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I also know why I carry now.

18K views 57 replies 37 participants last post by  Anonymous 
#1 ·
Last night, after I went to the shooting range with hedonistic, I went into a gas station and walked past a group of three Mexican guys and two girls, all in their mid 20's. I guess I looked at one of the girls for to long ( I didn't think I was looking at them) and her boyfriend (I assume) said "hey, you better watch where your looking!" Now I could have had a better reply than "What ever" but that's what I said. I paid for my drink and walked out to my car. The three guys followed me out and started threatening me. I got to my car told them to "stay back" with one had pointed at them and the other putting my key in the car door. As I opened my door they were in front of my car, so I turned put my hand on my gun and told them, "come any closer and I'll shoot all three of you." I didn't draw, but the threat was enough. Its funny how people don't want to get shot to prove their tough. One of them continued to say "F" you, but It was as they walked away so I didn't care. I got in my car and drove home, I was surprised how long my hands kept shaking. I debated calling dispatch but I decided since a gun wasn't drawn I didn't need to. It also taught me to carry every day even when I don't think I'll need it.
 
#2 ·
WHEW!!

Man, punks with bad attitudes really need to think about why they bully people. I mean, junior high and high school maybe, but these guys were clearly adults. What's the point of trying to prove your bravado by threatening someone when you're an adult? Sometimes you wanna say, "Grow up, huh?"

I guess I just don't see the point. That's why they have shows like "The World's Stupidest Criminals."

On the other hand, Scott, you handled yourself quite well. You're right, the "whatever" probably should have been something else, but you weren't exactly expecting to get threatened for something that silly. What a bunch of losers...

-Matt
 
#3 ·
I just don't understand why people act that way sometimes. It is a good feeling to know that your assailants KNEW you were armed. Unfortunately for me, my assailant will never know how close he potentially came to getting hurt and possibly killed.

I honestly think these types of people need to realize that we as law abiding citizens will not take kind of behavior and are prepared to defend ourselves.

You handled yourself well.
 
#4 ·
1) Was the gun in plain sight the whole time?

2) You should have called dispatch so they couldn't call first and spin the story.

edit:

3) Nice job telling them you would only draw if they came closer. IANAL, but hopefully that is enough legally. Any input guys?
 
#5 ·
xRapidDavex said:
1) Was the gun in plain sight the whole time?

2) You should have called dispatch so they couldn't call first and spin the story.

edit:

3) Nice job telling them you would only draw if they came closer. IANAL, but hopefully that is enough legally. Any input guys?
1. no It was concealed.
2.I thought about it for a while, but in the end I didn't.
3. If I had Pepper spray or a taser I would have used it with out hesitation.

Also being they were standing by the beer cooler, Intoxication my have been a factor (although they didn't sound drunk.)
 
#6 ·
Makes you wonder why some guys see looking at their girl (in a polite vs. a lewd way) as some sort of threat rather than the obvious compliment it is... :dunno:

Glad to hear it turned out OK!
 
#7 ·
I am glad you were safe. I (imo) would have called dispatch. I doubt they would have if they were intoxicated and people like that do not usually involve the police in their lives. The main reason I would have called and reported it is because if they were to follow you home and come back later and do something stupid you would have a report of what happened earlier to help back your story up. Just my $0.01 (can't afford 2 lol)
 
#8 ·
bane said:
Makes you wonder why some guys see looking at their girl (in a polite vs. a lewd way) as some sort of threat rather than the obvious compliment it is... :dunno:
Because they realize that a guy who's polite to their girl (as opposed to the way they treat her, as a possession), just might get the girl's interest.
 
#9 ·
swillden said:
bane said:
Makes you wonder why some guys see looking at their girl (in a polite vs. a lewd way) as some sort of threat rather than the obvious compliment it is... :dunno:
Because they realize that a guy who's polite to their girl (as opposed to the way they treat her, as a possession), just might get the girl's interest.
I also think that immature guys will think that a girl will like having a guy stick up for her, and just looking for a reason no matter how idiotic it is, and no matter how unnecessary.

I think you handled it very well, but it does bring up a question for myself, should I add the non emergency number to my speed dial, or just stick with 911? :dunno:
 
#10 ·
Gibbles said:
I think you handled it very well, but it does bring up a question for myself, should I add the non emergency number to my speed dial, or just stick with 911? :dunno:
That's a good question! And I think it brings up an even better question: what EXACTLY constitutes a 911-able emergency??? I have called 911 on a few occasions when I have observed obvious drunk driving and always worried that maybe it wasn't a full-blown 'emergency'... they have never corrected me or told me otherwise; it was always handled as an emergency. From that I have to think that any threat made against you would also be a 911-able emergency... however, I suppose in this case where they walked away you could argue that the TIMING of the problem had de-escalated it from a 911-able. In that case it would have been nice to have the non-911 number in your phone... but that's a problem in larger city areas where you are constantly moving between different jurisdictions... you never know which PD to have in your phone (unless you take the time to put ALL of them in!)... I would think if you have your phone on you and just dial 411 in these cases and ask them to forward you to the local PD dispatch that you'd be quick enough.

Thoughts???
 
#11 ·
As an after-though... I'm tempted to forgo the assumption that one should only call 911 in a TIMELY emergency... I'm tempted to do this for CYA reasons... which are:

1) Regardless of how upset they get at you, I doubt they will press charges against you for calling 911 in a non-timely emergency, yet they will now have your call timed and recorded... again, regardless of how mad they may or may not be.

2) The mere fact that you called 911 will weigh-in to demonstrate that you did indeed feel threatened and were trying to obtain the quickest source of help you could rather than just relying on your own "muscle". This demonstrates you aren't a gunslinger and are more than willing to try and get the PD to intervene at the soonest moment possible.

3) I would think (but I'm assuming) that a 911-report is escalated at the local PD (at least initially) over other non-911 calls and that you stand a better chance of getting a timely response from the PD in which case they might actually be able to catch up to the perps.

I say, if you feel threatened enough that you are on the very verge of pulling your weapon and very probably would have pulled non-lethal defense if you had had such, you are plenty justified in calling 911 even after the situation has de-escalated provided you call immediately and can say that the perps were still within the vicinity (thus, you are still worried).
 
#12 ·
801-840-4000. That is your non emergency police number. it goes to the West Jordan Dept. but it's the number I have been given by South Jordan, Midvale, and West Jordan Officers.

If you mention the word "gun" you will be put at the top of the list and police cars from all around will be there within seconds.
 
#13 ·
protectthe2 said:
801-840-4000. That is your non emergency police number. it goes to the West Jordan Dept. but it's the number I have been given by South Jordan, Midvale, and West Jordan Officers.

If you mention the word "gun" you will be put at the top of the list and police cars from all around will be there within seconds.
that is now saved in my phone.
 
#14 ·
protectthe2 said:
801-840-4000. That is your non emergency police number. it goes to the West Jordan Dept. but it's the number I have been given by South Jordan, Midvale, and West Jordan Officers.

If you mention the word "gun" you will be put at the top of the list and police cars from all around will be there within seconds.
The main reason for the 911 system is that it's easy to remember, and it works anytime you have phone service. A dispatcher will never, or Should never, question something YOU think is an 'emergency'. They're taught to gather up information and relay it to the appropriate entity so someone can respond to help you. There is a sort of triage process that takes place in order to determine which call takes priority, however, this is done internally, and the dispatcher should never make you feel as though your Emergency is less important then others.

Regarding the 'Gun' comment. If you didnt See a gun, Dont EVER "Mention the word 'Gun'" in hopes of a faster response!! First, it will piss off the cops, and second, you've started the call off with a LIE, so everything you say will be questionable; you will have no credibility, and it’s likely the cops wont file any charges.
 
#15 ·
Wow. Good job on keeping your cool through it all. I was shot at in Chicago one day (drive by, then they turned around to come back as we ran). Within about 30 minutes of being safe, my whole body was shaking. In my opinion, the most important thing is keeping your head despite the fear, adrenaline, etc. Good job.
 
#19 ·
TMG said:
Regarding the 'Gun' comment. If you didnt See a gun, Dont EVER "Mention the word 'Gun'" in hopes of a faster response!! First, it will piss off the cops, and second, you've started the call off with a LIE, so everything you say will be questionable; you will have no credibility, and it’s likely the cops wont file any charges.
I belive what he is trying to say is that you the caller is a CCW holder and are carrying and also will protect yourself not that they have a gun, saying that is a crime(false report).
 
#20 ·
Hey guys, about the 911 vs. non emergency number:

My wife used to be a 911 dispatcher for SL County and says it's not a problem to call 911 and even just asked to be forwarded to the local police dept if you don't already have the number. She says that it really isn't a problem to do that but just be mindful that other emergencies might be waiting behind you so try not to overuse the privelege.

Baisically, program the non emergency number to your hometown PD in your phone and even towns that you visit frequently but if for some reason you don't have it and want to reach police quickly just dial 911 and they will connect you to the local PD's dispatch.
 
#21 ·
murph said:
Hey guys, about the 911 vs. non emergency number:

My wife used to be a 911 dispatcher for SL County and says it's not a problem to call 911 and even just asked to be forwarded to the local police dept if you don't already have the number. She says that it really isn't a problem to do that but just be mindful that other emergencies might be waiting behind you so try not to overuse the privelege.

Baisically, program the non emergency number to your hometown PD in your phone and even towns that you visit frequently but if for some reason you don't have it and want to reach police quickly just dial 911 and they will connect you to the local PD's dispatch.
Good to know -- thanks!
 
#22 ·
scott.pete06 said:
The three guys followed me out and started threatening me.
In what way were they threatening you?

scott.pete06 said:
As I opened my door they were in front of my car, so I turned put my hand on my gun and told them, "come any closer and I'll shoot all three of you." I didn't draw, but the threat was enough.
Did you actually show them the gun?

scott.pete06 said:
I debated calling dispatch but I decided since a gun wasn't drawn I didn't need to.
I definitely think it would have been wise to call the police.
 
#23 ·
Great job on attempting to deescalate the situation.

I have the salt lake county dispatch number in my phone, it's 801-743-7000. FYI it is also recorded and timestamped so no worries there.

So I'm curious, I think I would have called dispatch, but I have a question for everyone. How would your conversation with dispatch go?
 
#24 ·
i have been thinking the same thing jared..

"hello, police dispatch, how may i help you?"

"yes, three guys just threatened me physical and bodily harm. i was able to deescalate the situtation. I am a licensed concealed weapon carrier, i did not ever show or draw my weapon however i did tell them if they took one more step closer to me i would shoot all three of them"

what should be said and what shouldn't be said?
what is the best way to say it?
 
#25 ·
lockout said:
i have been thinking the same thing jared..

"hello, police dispatch, how may i help you?"

"yes, three guys just threatened me physical and bodily harm. i was able to deescalate the situtation. I am a licensed concealed weapon carrier, i did not ever show or draw my weapon however i did tell them if they took one more step closer to me i would shoot all three of them"

what should be said and what shouldn't be said?
what is the best way to say it?
Although that's the very most straight-forward and perfectly honest report... I'm not sure I'd go quite that route; in this case I *DO* think it's a case of "the ends justify the means" sort of thing. To state "one more step closer and I would shoot all three of them" is likely to come across as "gunslinger-ish" to certain people including some of the responding LEO's and the DA that reviews it later... it's the sort of language, that though in the heat of the moment might seem perfectly appropriate (and c'mon, everyone makes word-choice mistakes in critical-timing situations) however in hindsight could be interpreted with a certain amount of bias.

If during the investigation you are asked for your *EXACT* wording then you might decide to provide the exact wording. But at the stage of the emergency phonecall I wouldn't state it that way; I would choose a more "PC" route and say something like "yes, three guys just... however I did tell them if they came any closer to me I would be interpret that as a threat against me and would be forced to resort to lethal self-defense." (or something similar, but you get my point)

ALWAYS choose your words very carefully. Be as PC as you can be. Then when the LEO's show up you aren't obliged to state exact wording before first contacting an attorney. Remember, even on the 911 call, your words can (and WILL) be used against you. Best to keep your tongue as cool as possible.
 
#26 ·
bane said:
lockout said:
i have been thinking the same thing jared..

"hello, police dispatch, how may i help you?"

"yes, three guys just threatened me physical and bodily harm. i was able to deescalate the situtation. I am a licensed concealed weapon carrier, i did not ever show or draw my weapon however i did tell them if they took one more step closer to me i would shoot all three of them"

what should be said and what shouldn't be said?
what is the best way to say it?
Although that's the very most straight-forward and perfectly honest report... I'm not sure I'd go quite that route; in this case I *DO* think it's a case of "the ends justify the means" sort of thing. To state "one more step closer and I would shoot all three of them" is likely to come across as "gunslinger-ish" to certain people including some of the responding LEO's and the DA that reviews it later... it's the sort of language, that though in the heat of the moment might seem perfectly appropriate (and c'mon, everyone makes word-choice mistakes in critical-timing situations) however in hindsight could be interpreted with a certain amount of bias.

If during the investigation you are asked for your *EXACT* wording then you might decide to provide the exact wording. But at the stage of the emergency phonecall I wouldn't state it that way; I would choose a more "PC" route and say something like "yes, three guys just... however I did tell them if they came any closer to me I would be interpret that as a threat against me and would be forced to resort to lethal self-defense." (or something similar, but you get my point)

ALWAYS choose your words very carefully. Be as PC as you can be. Then when the LEO's show up you aren't obliged to state exact wording before first contacting an attorney. Remember, even on the 911 call, your words can (and WILL) be used against you. Best to keep your tongue as cool as possible.
I agree.
You should report that THEY threatened you, not that YOU threatened them. I'd wait to see if an actual LEO was dispatched to talk to me before identifying myself as a CCW holder, and I wouldn't tell the LEO I had mentioned anything specifically about shooting anybody until I'd consulted an attorney. The BGs will lie against you one way or the other if caught, and you can bet they'll try to convince the LEO that you pointed an entire arsenal at them.

Also, the 911 discussion is interesting. I have called the police three times in the past 4 years to report non-emergency incidents, and each time I was transferred to 911 anyway.
 
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