Ammo versus...ammo?

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Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby christiansalazar12 » Wed 04 Feb 2015 9:12 pm

I normally pick up ammo (when its in stock) from Walmart. I was at Doug's Shootin' Sports the other day and they were telling me to never ever buy ammo from Walmart because they require it to be made at a much lower cost than the same ammo that is sold to sporting goods and gun stores. Due to being made a lot cheaper it is lower quality and could cause problems. I know Walmart has some interesting practices that allow them to offer very low prices, but I'd think a box of Winchester 9mm from Walmart would be the same as a box of Winchester 9mm from Doug's or Cabela's.
Anybody have any insight into this? sorry if its already posted someplace else. :dunno:
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby Snurd » Wed 04 Feb 2015 9:23 pm

I've heads the same from more than one source. I have had good experiences with Walmart ammo over many years. I haven't really paid attention enough to shoot ammo from Walmart and another source side by side to see if there is a difference or not.

You can get ammo online for a decent price of you don't want to buy from Walmart. Walmart's .223 ammo is quite a bit more than online. Even some of their other calibers can be more than online retailers.


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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby FrankenHollow » Wed 04 Feb 2015 11:40 pm

christiansalazar12 wrote:I know Walmart has some interesting practices that allow them to offer very low prices, but I'd think a box of Winchester 9mm from Walmart would be the same as a box of Winchester 9mm from Doug's or Cabela's.
Anybody have any insight into this? sorry if its already posted someplace else. :dunno:

Right now, you never know what any given retailer is going to have, since all of them are scrambling to get anything at all. But, under normal circumstances...
Why wouldn't it be any different?

Marlin firearms sold by Walmart are often "Walmart" models, not standard models. They're manufactured with lower quality standards, cheaper finishes, cheaper parts, and generally have no accessories that would otherwise be included. The same goes for many other manufacturers, as well. If you compare manufacturer model/SKU numbers, almost everyone you'll find at Walmart is unique to their stores (even if the model number stamped on the firearm is exactly the same).

95% of TVs and video players sold by Walmart are stripped down or outdated Walmart-only models.

Remington and Winchester rimfire ammunition sold in the unique Walmart-only bulk packs are manufactured with different quality standards than what everyone else gets. Remington, in particular, uses their lower grade recycled brass for the hulls that are destined for Walmart bulk packs.

The Winchester and Remington shotgun bulk packs sold by Walmart are usually manufactured by contractors with lower quality standards than standard Winchester and Remington production.

The Estate shotgun ammo sold by Walmart is nearly always imported (with corrosive primers) by ATK under the Estate brand name, whereas the stuff stocked by other retailers is manufactured in Minnesota, by Estate (without corrosive primers).


...So why would it be a stretch to find out that WWB handgun ammo is lower quality for Walmart purchase orders, than for standard production?

It's not true, but I would believe it.
In this particular case, there have been quite a few people that have tested the idea of Walmart getting lower quality 'Winchester White Box' ammo. In the end, they almost always discovered that the same lot numbers found at Walmart could be found on the shelves of many other retailers, as well. Winchester has also stated that they don't manufacture different 'grades' of ammunition in the Winchester USA line ("WWB"). It's all the same, no matter where it is going.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby Luv10mm » Thu 05 Feb 2015 7:37 am

I can't imagine ammunition manufacturers actually have a "cheapo" factory vs "normal" factory. Or whole assembly lines devoted to poor grade for specific distributors. I can see them packaging said ammo in distributor specific boxes or similar, but that's about it. It doesn't seem efficient otherwise.

While I rarely purchase factory ammo, I haven't noticed anything peculiar about Walmart vs others. :dunno:
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby D-FIN » Thu 05 Feb 2015 12:48 pm

I also have heard this as well as other stories about WWB. Many of the stories come out of places that go through lots of ammo so they tend to see more. I know Frontsight had told people they had seen plenty of problems with WWB. I've had guys a Doug's tell me that Tullamo was crap as well and not to use it. I have use both in the past and never had nay issue. The person I know who has seen real issues with WWB firsthand was dewittdj.

I had stopped buying WWB and Tula but right now that is mostly because I am reloading my own. If I buy factory I am likely to buy from freedom munitions in bulk.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby Paul » Thu 05 Feb 2015 5:30 pm

Buy your ammo from www.freedommunitions.com
Cheaper and ships to your door.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby JoeRandall » Thu 05 Feb 2015 5:53 pm

Paul wrote:Buy your ammo from http://www.freedommunitions.com
Cheaper and ships to your door.


That's what I have been using! Cheaper for brass case then walmarts steel case Tula. And they have free shipping often.


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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby Beretta96 » Thu 05 Feb 2015 6:04 pm

I use Freedom Munitions for calibers that I don't reload and I'm impressed with their reloads.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby jfwright1955 » Thu 05 Feb 2015 6:11 pm

Beretta96 wrote:I use Freedom Munitions for calibers that I don't reload and I'm impressed with their reloads.

+1
Freedom's my preferred "go to" ammo source as well for 9mm, .40 S&W, and .223.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby FrankenHollow » Thu 05 Feb 2015 11:38 pm

Luv10mm wrote:I can't imagine ammunition manufacturers actually have a "cheapo" factory vs "normal" factory. Or whole assembly lines devoted to poor grade for specific distributors. I can see them packaging said ammo in distributor specific boxes or similar, but that's about it. It doesn't seem efficient otherwise.

While I rarely purchase factory ammo, I haven't noticed anything peculiar about Walmart vs others. :dunno:

When it comes to ammunition, hardly anything in the 'high end' or 'budget' categories is what it seems. It's a game of smoke and mirrors, with brand recognition being the name of the game.

It isn't about separate factories or production lines. It's simply a matter of lowering the quality threshold.
...Or taking your rejects from standard production runs and selling them to cheapskate retailers at a discount.

But when you can contract out for the ammunition to be made by a third party, you can also specify lower (or higher) quality standards.

Weatherby brass ain't made by Weatherby. It's made by Norma, to Weatherby specifications (which are actually quite strict).

Remember Frontier Brass? They made good (and bad) brass for many different companies in the U.S. for many years. Then, they made Frontier and Hornady brass (as they were being dissolved and absorbed by Hornady). Guess which one was better... Nope, it was the brass that Frontier put their own name on.

Have you seen the "Winchester Metrics" line of ammunition? (7.62x54R, 6.5x55mm, 7.7x58mm Jap, etc) It may bear the Winchester head stamp, but it isn't manufactured by Winchester (or any other part of Olin). It's produced by Winchester-Olin's contractor of the week - sometimes PPU, sometimes S&B, sometimes Fiocchi, occasionally IMI, and even ArmsCor once in a while. ...But it's produced to Winchester's specifications. In some cases, the quality level is higher than that company's standard production (such as with S&B). But in other cases, Winchester's quality standards are actually lower than the 'native' quality of the brand (such as when PPU is contracted for the ammo).


Ever heard of the problems with Ruger's M77 barrels in the '70s and '80s? It was because they had terribly low quality Wilson barrels on them. But it wasn't Wilson's fault... They made the barrels exactly to Ruger's then ridiculously low quality standards. ("Does it look like a barrel? Then it's good enough!")
Yet, at the same time, Wilson was making barrels for Savage, Mossberg, and several other companies, whose rifles were setting records and winning matches almost literally 'straight out of the box'.

More recently, Wilson had to publicly ask Del-Ton to cease and desist from saying that their barrels were "made by Wilson". Del-Ton did, in fact, use Wilson barrel blanks to make their barrels. But the quality of Del-Ton's finished barrels was lower than what Wilson would have required if they were going to put their own name on it.

Did you know that Thompson Investment Castings (Thompson Center) and Ruger Investment Castings (Formerly Pine Tree Castings) manufacture investment cast parts for nearly every major firearm manufacturer in the United States, and RIC is responsible for over 90% of single action revolver frames?
Just because it says Savage on the side, doesn't mean that it isn't part Ruger, part Thompson, and part Smith & Wesson (the MIM specialists)....
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby Luv10mm » Fri 06 Feb 2015 8:38 am

Dang FrankenHollow, that's crazy! I'm assuming reloading components are just as convoluted and unknown? Also, where the crud did you find out all that stuff? I'm guessing that's the kind of info manufacturers want to keep hush hush. I don't know what to think anymore... :ack:
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby MichaelD » Fri 06 Feb 2015 9:39 am

christiansalazar12 wrote:I normally pick up ammo (when its in stock) from Walmart. I was at Doug's Shootin' Sports the other day and they were telling me to never ever buy ammo from Walmart because they require it to be made at a much lower cost than the same ammo that is sold to sporting goods and gun stores. Due to being made a lot cheaper it is lower quality and could cause problems. I know Walmart has some interesting practices that allow them to offer very low prices, but I'd think a box of Winchester 9mm from Walmart would be the same as a box of Winchester 9mm from Doug's or Cabela's.
Anybody have any insight into this? sorry if its already posted someplace else. :dunno:


I'll call BS on that. Over the last six years I've put in excess of 15,000 rounds of Walmart-purchased WWB, Federal, Remington, and even Tula ammo through my pistols and have never had an issue. Total bull on the part of Doug's.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby MrReverse » Fri 06 Feb 2015 5:21 pm

The salesperson at the store is completely unbiased right? :lolbang: I kinda think that he just might prefer that you would buy your ammo from him rather than a compeditor. :raisedbrow: I would be willing to bet the price markup is a bit higher to compensate for lower volume. I have a hard time beliving that ammo manufactures will have a dedicated line for Walmart, just doesnt seem practical and could lead to quality control and inventory issues running a lower quality line with your standard lines. Don't see a real cost savings with a low cost disposable product doing that.

However, I am just a simple auto mechanic and don't have a business degree, so I am probably wrong.
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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby FrankenHollow » Fri 06 Feb 2015 11:12 pm

Luv10mm wrote:Dang FrankenHollow, that's crazy! I'm assuming reloading components are just as convoluted and unknown? Also, where the crud did you find out all that stuff? I'm guessing that's the kind of info manufacturers want to keep hush hush. I don't know what to think anymore... :ack:

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Re: Ammo versus...ammo?

Postby RustyShackleford » Sun 08 Feb 2015 8:36 am

I would find it hard to believe that Winchester or Wally-World would set themselves up for a mega-lawsuit by selling inferior Ammo. If even the ammo was perfectly safe, but under powered or unreliable primers...etc, compared to the same ammo going to "Joe Dokes Sporting Emporium. A case could be made that if an accident of any kind happened using WWWB, they would be screwed because of they Knowingly colluded to sell an inferior product.

I think this is a rumor that the little guys are throwing out their. I feel for them because Wally-World does take a lot of business from them because of Price Only.
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