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:shocked:

Tuesday, April 29, 2008

WEST PALM BEACH â€" It could've been a typical spat between grocery store customer and manager, with the customer announcing he planned to take his business elsewhere. But then the customer drew his gun. The store manager drew his and so did the assistant manager.

It all happened at 5 p.m. Monday at the IGA Supermarket at 1000 36th St. in West Palm Beach. And in the end, West Palm Beach police arrested customer Marshall Hugo Grant for attempted first-degree murder, shooting into an occupied dwelling, aggravated assault with a firearm and carrying a concealed firearm.

Police reported Tuesday morning that Grant, 73, entered the store through the exit despite manager Marino Hernandez's warning not to enter that way. The confrontation escalated, Grant drew a handgun; assistant manager Roberto Espinal drew his handgun. Hernandez also pulled a gun. Grant backed out of the store, firing three times as he went, the arrest report states.

The managers, who witnesses said never returned fire, ended up surrounding Grant, who hid behind a vehicle while continuing to fire, according to the police report. Grant eventually surrendered his weapon to the managers, once they told him police were on their way.

Grant appeared Tuesday morning before Judge Nancy Perez, who ordered him held without bond while he undergoes a psychiatric examination.
It only mentions the bad guy as carrying concealed.

Attempted "Suicide by manger" maybe? :lolbang:

I'd say the manager and assistant showed GREAT restraint. I don't know if I would be as controlled after being shot at multiple times. If someone shoots at me, I'll do my best to ensure that they won't be going home.

:nilly:
 

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mchlwise said:
I'd say the manager and assistant showed GREAT restraint. I don't know if I would be as controlled after being shot at multiple times. If someone shoots at me, I'll do my best to ensure that they won't be going home.
+1. Bullets flying around haphazardly seem like justification enough for me to stop the threat.
 

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mchlwise, do you have a link to the source of the story? Thanks.
 

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Here's a source on the story. This one also does not mention that the store managers were legal to CCW. Now if the bad guy had a permit, I'll bet it would mention so in the headline.

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/news/local/ ... 6760.story

It is interesting that they didn't fire back. While my first impression was that I'd have lit the guy up, I then considered that this is probably a busy parking lot in a busy part of town and that maybe their constraint was really justified.

Update: Here's one with a few more details: "I'm a quick thinker. When I saw the first bullet hit high, right away I knew I was dealing with someone that was not a good shooter."
 

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Interesting. In the 911 call it sounded like the manager followed the guy out of the store. If he had shot the bad guy outside the store would it have been a bad shoot?
 

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apollosmith said:
This one also does not mention that the store managers were legal to CCW.
In many states, it's perfectly legal to conceal without a permit in your own residence or place of business, and you can give permission to others as well. I'm pretty sure Florida allows it, which would make the manager and assistant manager legal to CCW.
 

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MarshallDodge said:
Interesting. In the 911 call it sounded like the manager followed the guy out of the store. If he had shot the bad guy outside the store would it have been a bad shoot?
My opinion -- the situation was still on-going so the manager could still be engaged in causing the goof to stop. Manager may have thought the goof continued to present a threat to people outside of the store.
 

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UtahCFP beat me to it:

Manager may have thought the goof continued to present a threat to people outside of the store.
+1, just what I was going to say.
 

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Now let's do a little thought experiment. What if the manager and assistant manager had not been armed?

In the news account, it said that the assailant shot as he retreated, but would he have been retreating and shooting or advancing and shooting if he had not been confronted by those who were armed?

I'm betting that if he had not been met with parity of force, there might have been more than one fatality.

Sounds like this had a good outcome. The manager & assistant manager did indeed show great restraint, but they stopped the shooter.
 

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Jeff Johnson said:
Now let's do a little thought experiment. What if the manager and assistant manager had not been armed?

In the news account, it said that the assailant shot as he retreated, but would he have been retreating and shooting or advancing and shooting if he had not been confronted by those who were armed?

I'm betting that if he had not been met with parity of force, there might have been more than one fatality.

Sounds like this had a good outcome. The manager & assistant manager did indeed show great restraint, but they stopped the shooter.
A third possibility is that the goof only wanted to scare them and wasn't intending to shoot. Is it possible the goof thought he was "forced" into shooting to "defend" himself once he was countered. I see this sort of logic used in TV shows and movies a lot.

Seems the outcome was good. I wonder if I would have fired or not if I were in that store...
 
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