Help me pick a gun and caliber

3650 Views 21 Replies 13 Participants Last post by xmirage2kx, Apr 2, 2008

MarkM

Discussion Starter · Mar 22, 2008

I will be taking a CC class in the next few weeks and hope to get my CC permit by summer. I am trying to decide on what CC gun and caliber to get.

To be honest I am not sure how much I will carry around town (I am sure i will some) my main reason for getting a CC and carying a gun will be to have somehting when I take my family camping to have some protection against the two leg variaty as well as possible couger and bear problems.

I also want to carry when I bowhunt as I had a couger follow me for a about 50 yards last fall on the bowhunt . Caliber wise I want something that will work against the threat of people, cougers, and black bears and in a gun that is not too heavy or bulky, my wife already teases me that I carry everything but the kitchen sink in my backpack when hunting.

I have around $400 to spend on a gun. I am leaning toward a Bersa Thunder 45ACP Ultra Compact or a Springfield XD 45 compact.

Mark

1 - 20 of 22 Posts

Crusader Smithy

· #2 · Mar 22, 2008

Out of your two options I would go with the XD. Use the gun to scare away cougers and black bear. You may just piss off the bear.

GeneticsDave

· #3 · Mar 22, 2008

Even though I'm not a huge fan of revolvers, a .357 S&W airlite might be a good option. It's got a lighter frame (aluminum, titanium, etc) and shoots a caliber that would do you well against small predators (cougars, etc). For any bear I would first say get a rifle, then I would say get some bear spray, finally if a sidearm had to be used, I would say a S&W 500 snubby. Most conventional sidearms are going to be next to worthless against the thick fur, skin and fat of a bear - and don't even try penetrating the skull!

Of the two you are looking at, I would go with the XD, some of the compact 1911s have issues with feeding, etc, and I'm not too familiar with the Bersa to recommend it as reliable. The XD is reliable and is a great self-defense weapon - especially against any two legged predators!

Jeff Johnson

· #4 · Mar 22, 2008

It sounds like you have very different requirements to lay on a single gun.
Something to defend against bear attack may not be what you'd want to carry daily for in-town protection.

I'm no bear-hunting expert, but I wouldn't want to go with anything small. I'd probably want at least a .44 Mag or S&W 500 to use as a last resort, but I'd really prefer a rifle against a bear.

For a daily carry gun (and don't dismiss that possibility outright), you need to go with what is comfortable in your hand. I'd go to the gun stores and handle a variety of guns. See what fits. Then go rent some guns to try shooting. People are very different. What works well for one person may not work well for you. You can get a lot of opinions as to what is best for CC, but that doesn't mean that those opinions are really valid to you.

Crusader Smithy

· #5 · Mar 23, 2008

JeffJohnson is right. I wouldn't anything less than a 44mag for bears. You really are looking at two different sets of requirements.

Crackshot

· #6 · Mar 24, 2008

I agree about the two different requirements. What you'll need for a bear attack will not be ideal for comfortable carry. I'd recommend a reliable brand that shoots .45 ACP if you are looking for something to carry and defend against dangerous animals.... The other day I saw in C-A-L Ranch in Logan a new Taurus revolver that shoots the .45 colt. This thing looked awesome. I don't recall the name but it is marketed to put the hurt on a mad bear, at least slow it down! This could be an option if you're ever considering a handgun solely for bear defense.

Kevin Jensen

· #7 · Mar 25, 2008

You probably saw the Taurus Judge. It can fire the .45 Long Colt, or 410 shotgun shells.

xmirage2kx

· #8 · Mar 25, 2008

THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT For your needs. Small/Light/easy to carry. Will drop anything under 1000lbs pretty easily. I wouldn't plan on going after a bear with anything shy of a rifle or a shotty with slugs, but if I needed to count on a handgun this would be it. It is a little more than you want to spend, but you may find it cheaper used or other places.

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tapehoser

· #9 · Mar 25, 2008

Since when did a black bear become some unstoppable foe??? The largest black bear you're likley (or unlikely) to encounter here in Utah isn't going to pass 250 pounds. That said, take a 250 pound man, and I'll have no problem punching a few holes through him with a stoutly loaded .45 ACP cartridge. Same applies for a black bear. I would have NO qualms whatsoever about taking a .45 ACP into the wilderness for protection against ANYTHING this state has to offer....be it man OR beast.

That said, if I were wandering into a place where grizzlies were known to inhabit, the .44 Mag would be my minimum choice of caliber.

divegeek

· #10 · Mar 25, 2008

tapehoser said:
That said, if I were wandering into a place where grizzlies were known to inhabit, the .44 Mag would be my minimum choice of caliber.

I think I'll stick with a .30 caliber weapon when in grizzly country -- .30-06, .308, .300 Win Mag

tapehoser

· #11 · Mar 25, 2008

swillden said:
I think I'll stick with a .30 caliber weapon when in grizzly country -- .30-06, .308, .300 Win Mag

Yeah, it's one thing to carry a 300 Winnie when you're purpose is HUNTING. But another issue altogether when you're hiking and carrying 30-40 pounds of gear. I know you understood what I meant, but in case anyone else did not, I was talking purely about a handgun.

Depending upon the weight of my pack I'm going to carry 1 of 3 things:

1) An XD45 Compact - for especially grueling hikes where weight is an issue.
2) A Winchester Model 94 carbine loaded with .44 Mag hunting/defensive rounds - for leisurely hikes that might be longer, but not as grueling.
3) A Marlin 45-70 with 300 grain bullets - for serious country where grizzlies might be encountered.

G

· #12 · Mar 27, 2008

Seems like you have 2 carry goals that require quite different guns. I love the XD's. I have an XD 40 and I would trust my life to it, but I sure as heck wouldn't want to shoot at a bear with it. For concealed carry I own the Kel-tec pf-9. It has what I am looking for being new to concealed carry. It is small, has a slim profile. Holds 7+1 rounds of a respectable caliber (9mm) and is very easy to conceal, particularly with the belt clip added. The downside to it is it is very light and you do feel the recoil. I guess if you were able to get a short barreled revolver of .357 mag, .327 mag or .44 mag, it might be the compromise you are looking for but you certainly would want to give yourself plenty of practice managing the recoil, particularly in the .44 mag before trusting your life to it. Thats all I have to say about that I guess. or maybe consider the noisy cricket!!

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GeneticsDave

· #13 · Mar 27, 2008

sculptingmyguns said:
Or maybe consider the noisy cricket!!

I dunno, did you see the recoil that thing has?!?! I would rather carry around a S&W 500! :lolbang:

fnfnc64

· #14 · Mar 27, 2008

I read an article that talked about the .45 being ok for defense against Black Bear. I usually have one along when Im out riding fourwheelers or hiking (not that I hike alot.....)You would have to be nuts to hunt bear with anything smaller that a nice stout .30 cal, but in a pinch an XD beats sticks and rocks any day.
The old joke goes- A guy walks into a bar in Alaska wearing a holstered .44 mag. So one of the locals asks him "Hey pal, what you planning on doing with that six shooter?". The guy responds "I'm going bear huntin with it". So the local says "You might want to file the front sight off that thing before ya go." So the guy says "Why is that?" The local replies "So it wont hurt so bad when the bear takes it away from you and stuffs it up your........"well, you get the picture 8)

Paul

· #15 · Mar 27, 2008

fnfnc64 said:
I read an article that talked about the .45 being ok for defense against Black Bear. I usually have one along when Im out riding fourwheelers or hiking (not that I hike alot.....)You would have to be nuts to hunt bear with anything smaller that a nice stout .30 cal, but in a pinch an XD beats sticks and rocks any day.
The old joke goes- A guy walks into a bar in Alaska wearing a holstered .44 mag. So one of the locals asks him "Hey pal, what you planning on doing with that six shooter?". The guy responds "I'm going bear huntin with it". So the local says "You might want to file the front sight off that thing before ya go." So the guy says "Why is that?" The local replies "So it wont hurt so bad when the bear takes it away from you and stuffs it up your........"well, you get the picture 8)

:ROFL:

marksman

· #16 · Mar 27, 2008

I'm not taking my 7 1/2 pound .30-06 hiking. so if it's between my .40 or nothing what would all of you recommend?

GeneticsDave

· #17 · Mar 27, 2008

Well duh! Take your .40! If you're worried about bears, I would seriously consider bringing some spray.

roseblood

· #18 · Mar 27, 2008

Bear spray has a statistically better chance at repelling an angry bear than a gun does.

divegeek

· #19 · Mar 28, 2008

roseblood said:
Bear spray has a statistically better chance at repelling an angry bear than a gun does.

+1

G

· #20 · Apr 1, 2008

Well, just to play devil's advocate, I figure if you have to ask the question of whether to take a 40 or nothing, I say nothing. I have no good reason to say it except to be arbitrary and point out that that isn't much of a question really.

On a more helpful note however, if you do carry a 40 and wish to maximize its effectiveness against a bear or other large critter you might come across, you can at least try some +P loads. Im speaking of an XD, but you want to make sure any gun you have can handle +P loads. One brand that impresses me when I view the muzzle energy and velocity are the loads from Double Tap and Buffalo Bore.

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