[RobFindlay]

Let me first off say I'm a left winger....please no flaming, really I'm what you would call a Libertarian-Socialist --just look it up in wikipedia if your curious what that means.

Twice I have been assualted for the bumper stickers on my car "impeach bush" "Free palestine" "Obama 08" (not trying to start political discussion just adding context.

The first it was an ex co-worker who shoved me and called me coward-commie-traitor, I called Taylorsville police they refused to file a report.

A couple of weeks ago I was coming of Beans And Brews again in taylorsville and had someone point at the back of my car, called me a traitor walked up against me pinning me to my car and told me with his finger in face that he "kills traitors"

He looked millitary and tried to explain my Nephew was on his 4 tour in Iraq but would listen.

The guy walked off....i was shaken and scared half to death.

I grew up around guns --though dad never taught me anything, I have antique shotgun and Remington model 16 rifles on my wall so i'm not afraid of guns.

My mom has given me my Dad's Colt mark IV .380 nickle plated and I've been going to range. Need to find someone to "teach" me how to shoot --think my cousin or brother in law has that covered.

As soon as I can afford it I'm taking my CCW class at Doug's and I'm going to start packing. I don't ever want to live in fear again.

Now I wouldn't have pulled my weapon on this guy but knowing that I ultimately had the ability to defend myself might have given me more confidence.

I dunno can youTELL someone who is being threatening towards you that your armed whilst just having your hand behind your back on the pistol grip ready to draw if you had to?

Anyway what really scares me is that he saw my license plate, I'm a ham radio operator, so it's my callsign you google it and boom the first it is the FCC listing of my license and my home address..

Anyway maybe I'll tell more about myslef later I just wanted to get that out...

-R

 

[RobFindlay]

that the 2nd assualt the Tayorsville police refused to even take a report. Saying that he hadnt ACTUALLY threatened me or assaulted me and suggested I change my bumper stickers.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

Welcome to our forum, Rob!
We're glad to have you join us ... even from the 'dark side'... :wink:
(take that as an attempt at humor)

Assault on a person for expressing his or her political views is absolutely unacceptable. Our brave military men and women are defending and have long defended the Constitution of the United States, which includes the protection of the right to free speech.

Stick around and participate. You might not get a lot of agreement here on many political issues, but we are by no means a monolithic body in political lockstep anyway. If people disagree with you, don't take offense. They are free to express their opinions too.

 

[Car Knocker]

Welcome to the UCC forum, Rob!

 

[RobFindlay]

Welcome to our forum, Rob!
We're glad to have you join us ... even from the 'dark side'... :wink:
(take that as an attempt at humor)

Assault on a person for expressing his or her political views is absolutely unacceptable. Our brave military men and women are defending and have long defended the Constitution of the United States, which includes the protection of the right to free speech.

Stick around and participate. You might not get a lot of agreement here on many political issues, but we are by no means a monolithic body in political lockstep anyway. If people disagree with you, don't take offense. They are free to express their opinions too.

Thank ya sir!

Now i just gotta find the best way to carry this in the pants holster considering i have a hard enough time keeping my pants up as it is. With my fashion sense i'm going to have wear suspenders over my undershirt with a t-shirt over that. I don't think I could conceal a shoulder rig.

Oh, do you still need to go get fingerprinted at the federal building before your CCW class?

-R

 

[Paul]

Wow. Welcome aboard. You aren't shy! Glad to have you here. Sign up for a concealed class ASAP. A good one takes care of everything including fingerprints during the class. Go back and start reading old posts or search them. Most of your questions will probably already have answers posted here somewhere. Have fun and enjoy.

 

[davyut]

You have the right idea Rob get that permit and enjoy the freedom the constitution gives us all. Welcome and enjoy this forum

 

[coqui]

welcome

 

[coprtoppe]

Welcome! (from another newbie here)

It would serve any CCW holder well to keep a low profile.

But if you are going to display provacative opinions, maybe a plate that doesn't reveal personal info would be a better choice.

Even a justified shoot could have long-term negative effects, so no sense in bringing about confrontations. It seems you have already identified items that can cause you trouble.

Tony

 

[GeneticsDave]

Well, I may not agree with your political views, I nevertheless agree that they should not be a reason for personal confrontations. Just remember that weapons are not a panacea for all the bassackward bullies out there. It is wise to protect oneself and this applies not only to your ability to resist force, but also to avoid it altogether.

Get your permit, practice and study the laws. If you get your permit through a good company, they will provide pictures and fingerprinting and perhaps notary for your application. If not, you will need prints from your local police station, passport photos and a notary public.

Good luck and post often!

 

[divegeek]

You might consider open carrying. Not only would it allow you to start carrying before you get your CFP, but the weapon's visible presence would deter assault without you having to say a word, or do anything threatening. It might also make the sort of neanderthals who would threaten you for your political views pause, because the stereotype is that one who holds your views is deathly afraid of guns.

OC doesn't work for everyone, and your employer probably won't allow it at work, so it can't be done everywhere, but there are a growing number of regular OC'ers in Utah. Nearly all of them have CFPs but choose to OC for reasons of comfort and 2A activism -- to demonstrate to the public at large that guns aren't evil and law-abiding citizens can carry them peacefully and safely.

OC also requires a certain level of self-confidence, and knowledge of the law, because you do occasionally run into people, and even police officers, who don't believe you can do that. Of course whether open or concealed anyone who's going to carry should first thoroughly understand the relevant law. I'd take a CFP class and then spend some time thinking things through and asking questions here before you carry, open or not.

You might want to join the discussion at opencarry.org for more information about the ins and outs of open carry in general and in Utah.

In response to your original question about how you can make your concealed weapon's presence known to deter an assault: That's tricky, and the most correct answer is "You can't". Threatening with a deadly weapon can be construed as assault and saying "Don't push me, I've got a gun" or anything like that might land you in hot water.

Your CFP instructor will cover lots of scenarios in detail, and your legal options for responding. That's the bulk of what a CFP class is: understanding the law as it relates to use of deadly force. Take the class.

Finally, you really MIGHT want to think about toning down the way you present your political opinions. I have some pretty unorthodox opinions myself, and even a bumper sticker or two, but I don't get hassled so I'm wondering if you are somehow particularly loud about it. I don't mean to imply that you should curtail your free speech, but it might be worth examining your approach to decide if maybe an excessively aggressive attitude on your part is part of the problem. It may or may not be, but it's worth some serious thought.

 

[RobFindlay]

You might consider open carrying. Not only would it allow you to start carrying before you get your CFP, but the weapon's visible presence would deter assault without you having to say a word, or do anything threatening. It might also make the sort of neanderthals who would threaten you for your political views pause, because the stereotype is that one who holds your views is deathly afraid of guns.

OC doesn't work for everyone, and your employer probably won't allow it at work, so it can't be done everywhere, but there are a growing number of regular OC'ers in Utah. Nearly all of them have CFPs but choose to OC for reasons of comfort and 2A activism -- to demonstrate to the public at large that guns aren't evil and law-abiding citizens can carry them peacefully and safely.

OC also requires a certain level of self-confidence, and knowledge of the law, because you do occasionally run into people, and even police officers, who don't believe you can do that. Of course whether open or concealed anyone who's going to carry should first thoroughly understand the relevant law. I'd take a CFP class and then spend some time thinking things through and asking questions here before you carry, open or not.

You might want to join the discussion at opencarry.org for more information about the ins and outs of open carry in general and in Utah.

In response to your original question about how you can make your concealed weapon's presence known to deter an assault: That's tricky, and the most correct answer is "You can't". Threatening with a deadly weapon can be construed as assault and saying "Don't push me, I've got a gun" or anything like that might land you in hot water.

Your CFP instructor will cover lots of scenarios in detail, and your legal options for responding. That's the bulk of what a CFP class is: understanding the law as it relates to use of deadly force. Take the class.

Finally, you really MIGHT want to think about toning down the way you present your political opinions. I have some pretty unorthodox opinions myself, and even a bumper sticker or two, but I don't get hassled so I'm wondering if you are somehow particularly loud about it. I don't mean to imply that you should curtail your free speech, but it might be worth examining your approach to decide if maybe an excessively aggressive attitude on your part is part of the problem. It may or may not be, but it's worth some serious thought.

Maybe everyone in Taylorsville are red-neck nuts? j/k Maybe I just got un-lucking.

I don't know what set them off, I wear a long beard maybe they thought I Muslim too....though you'd thing the longer hair the trench coat cowboy boots and hat would convince otherwise.

I'm a Buddhist as well so this is a hard decision for me to make.

-R

 

[MasLakas]

Welcome to the forum and thank you for posting such an honest intro. My life would suck if everyone around me had the same beliefs on all issues as I do. I enjoy talking, NOT arguing, issues and listening to others points of view so I better understand why others have those views. I do not tolerate the "I am right because you are not" attitude as I worked with an individual who almost daily tried to tell me that simply having a view shared by the Republican party meant instant damnation and there was zero discussion with on his issues. He was simply right about everything. He now lives alone with no friends and management put him in the warehouse where his contact with other employees is limited because he would not stop harassing others for their political or religions view. Enough of that.

Look in the training area of the forum to see if there are classes or instructors in you area. My Instructor took the pictures and did the finger printing before the class. During the class, ask the questions you have posed here and good luck.

 

[ian husford]

I'm a Buddhist as well so this is a hard decision for me to make.

Welcome to the forum.

I can understand and appreciate the decision concerning getting the permit.

ian

 

[Strategic Tactical]

Rob, I want to do the class for you for FREE. Politics aside, I think EVERYONE should have what they need to defend themselves. Contact me through our website at www.strategictacticalgroup.com so we can get the class taken care of for ya. Be safe.

 

[divegeek]

Rob, I want to do the class for you for FREE. Politics aside, I think EVERYONE should have what they need to defend themselves. Contact me through our website at www.strategictacticalgroup.com so we can get the class taken care of for ya. Be safe.

Can't beat that with a stick.

Everyone who's taken Chris' class seems to have really enjoyed it. I've been thinking I should sit in on one just because it sounds like such fun.

 

[Car Knocker]

I'm a Buddhist as well so this is a hard decision for me to make.

-R

Perhaps this tidbit may be of assistance:

"If someone has a gun and is trying to kill you, it would be reasonable to shoot back with your own gun."

-- The Dalai Lama, (May 15, 2001, The Seattle Times) speaking at the "Educating Heart Summit" in Portland, Oregon, when asked by a girl how to react when a shooter takes aim at a classmate

 

[James]

Welcome to the group.

Yes, get your CFP. We should all have the means to defend ourselves and our families regardless of political persuasion.

I am a Ham operator too and have call letter plates. You are sure right about Googling that to come up with name, address, etc. It is amazing how much stuff Google can come up with about me in a heartbeat.

For the most part I am cool with that though as I have nothing to hide.

I hate writing on clothing or cars, trucks, whatever. I wouldn't even have license plates if it wasn't required. I am not going to go around loooking like a billboard.

We may have different opinions on some things, but would bet we can agree on many, and I will defend your right to your opinion.

Have a nice day.

 

[CR500AF]

Welcome. Get your permit.

you should listen to Michael Savage. He is a guy who may have some beliefs similar to yours in some ways. He is on 1430 AM, 4:00pm-7:00 pm. :wink:

 

[RobFindlay]

Rob, I want to do the class for you for FREE. Politics aside, I think EVERYONE should have what they need to defend themselves. Contact me through our website at www.strategictacticalgroup.com so we can get the class taken care of for ya. Be safe.

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