Utah Guns Forum banner

Just more proof that no-knock warrants are a bad idea

9241 Views 66 Replies 17 Participants Last post by  Aether
ksl.com said:
Robbers break into Salt Lake City home and terrorize family

Click picture for video:

A man was beaten during a robbery. It happened around 4 a.m. The victim's wife said she didn't know who the robbers were.

She didn't want to go on camera, but she shared with Eyewitness News the scary details. She said her 8-year-old daughter awoke to screaming and witnessed her stepfather being beaten by two masked men.

"I'm scared for their safety," said Anthony Romero, the victim's son. "They just barely moved into the house. It's a nice house, nice area, nice people."

Anthony Romero said his family moved into the house near 1500 South and 1000 West two months ago. That has police wondering if the violent home invasion was a case of mistaken identity. Salt Lake City Police Detective Shawn Smart said, "There's a possibility that these people could have had the wrong house."

It was 4 o'clock in the morning. The family was asleep when two men dressed in black and wearing ski masks ripped the screen and broke through a basement window in the back of the house.

Romero, who was at another relative's home this morning, said the men went into his 10-year-old brother's room first. He said, "My little brother, they pointed a shotgun at him and said, ‘Where's your mom and dad?'"

Inside the master bedroom, the men yelled at Romero's mother and stepfather, demanding money and drugs.

The woman said the men wore what looked like police SWAT uniforms. She said they identified themselves as police officers and wore badges around their necks.

When the robbers didn't get what they wanted, the men put a pillowcase over her husband's head and beat him. "They just beat him up with a gun a couple of times, tried to choke him for some money. I don't know why," Romero said.

The men left with some cash and the victims' car keys. Police haven't been able to find them. Smart said, "Anybody that does this type of thing, they're dangerous."

The men wore masks, so police don't have a good description of the suspects. If you have any information, call Salt Lake City police at 799-3000.
So how are we supposed to know who's a LEO and who isn't when there is no warning and no warrant? If we shoot, we could be killed by the real LEOs. This is messed up.
1 - 4 of 67 Posts
The men wore masks, so police don't have a good description of the suspects.
So if "We, the People," are unable to tell whom a terrorist is, haw can anyone? No knocks and masks worn by officers, regardless of expressed concerns by law enforcement, are an evil which ought to righteously be outlawed.
In this incident the perpetrators represented themselves to be "law enforcement" though their actions went way beyond what most officers would do. In a case like this these people would have been honestly justified, had an opportunity presented itself, to draw and fire as they were in fear of life and limb. So too would they have been justified had it been actual law enforcement at the "wrong" place.
If it is not possible to get a proper search warrant describing the person, place or things to be searched a no knock is definitely not the way to go. Biding one's time is probably much better as you can almost always wait for, or anticipate an exodus from a dwelling which would create a safer environment to take down a suspect with much better control and threat to the general public. It was unlawful searches which were performed by the British which caused warrants to be written into the constitution in order to protect us all. (Declaration of Independence, Bill of Rights Article IV)
I am sure by this time we are all of the opinion that these trespassers/terrorists were not police. This being the case it is all the more imperative that the safety of all citizens be ensured by no violation of constitutional rights for service of no knocks, which do violate citizen rights.
During the debates preceding the establishment of the constitution it was mentioned, on more than one occasion, that the rights of the people were so solemn that the violation of one persons rights was tantamount to treason. For this cause we were protected. Unfortunately the judiciary seem to feel that this is not the case and in so thinking violate their oaths of office, as well as their responsibilty to the public, as do police, when no knocks are requested and granted.
For this I say shame on them!
See less See more
In other words, is the killing of innocent and good members of our society worth the cost of fighting the war on drugs in this fashion??? I, for one, do not think it is. And, what's more, I think history shows us that the argument that waging such wars "at any and all costs" is the common thread among fascist and despotic regimes.
Amen Bane! +1 on this.

Also, Genetics Dave said:
The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no Warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by Oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized.

Did you see that? No knock warrants are indeed unreasonable. A reasonable person does not barge into your home. They knock on your door, tell you what they are there for and then serve the warrant. The purpose of effecting the law should never trump constitutional rights.
A huge +1 to that too!

Excellent points by both gentlemen & I, for one, am in complete agreement and harmony with their thoughts on the matter.
swillden said:
Of course, honest cops always have the option of protecting themselves by not engaging in aggressive entries.
AMEN! :agree: And I say again, AMEN!
Llewellyn added that when police have reason to believe there might be firearms in a residence, they take precautions to ensure the safety of the officers and anyone inside the house.
Somehow I truly doubt this. The only safety engaged in in this raid was the multiple sets of guns in the hands of brutish overzealous thugs (police). The treatment of the victims in this story, at both residences is not in tune with this statement. Truly a hostile and militaristic tactic and not a civil servant inspired sense of duty and respect for their fellowman in this instance. Violations of all types of civil rights here, not to mention that these police committed acts of violence in the presence of a minor child, and unlike the treatment we would receive for such an act, they will go free to commit other acts of violence and mayhem in the future without the same worries we would have to concern ourselves with.
1 - 4 of 67 Posts
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.