Yeah, we have gotten off-Topic some what, but the conversation is still good. Boycott Impact Guns! I too got that bad info from them. I found out the "easy way" from GET SOME GUNS AND AMMO, they are very friendly there and pointed me in the right direction. I bought two Suppressors from Impact, but my next will be from Get Some.
Lee Kay Center
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Don't tempt me to start a new boycott thread. :bat:CR500AF said:
The guy I work with at "get some" is named is MIke, and he has been pleasant to work with, he is opinionated but nice to work with. There have been a few low lifes there that seem like bone heads! But you get that every where. That's why I don't shop, I just buy. I research all I can online, ask friends I can trust, then call around and price shop until I can find the best deal, then when I actually go to a shop I am only there to buy, not to hear any of their biased opinions. This has worked good for me.
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I agree. They didn't allow me to OC when I went there with my wife one time. Just prior to that I had been OCing thru the Hunters Ed class I took there :roll: . I rather pay $8 to Dougs or Drive to Tooele where the is an area to shoot atCR500AF said:
You know what is funny now! :lolbang: My ward is having a Trap shoot for the Elder's Quorum this Saturday, and it is at the Lee Kay Center :ROFL: I guess that serves me right, talking on here like I'll never go back, and now I gotta go Saturday! :ack:
In defense of Lee Kay, I need to make a couple points. I shoot bow and guns there every week. 3$ let's me shoot my bow, my rifle and my pistols all day if I want. They're good folks doing a good job, and that's a fact.
First, the Center is staffed by volunteers. Volunteerism, especially when it comes to promoting shooting sports, gets my unequivocal support. Know who your friends are, folks.
Second, as a public facility (NOT a business), that promotes shooting sports, safety must be their first priority and they absolutely cannot rely on the public's common sense or firearms experience. But at the same time, they have to deal with a lot of attitude. I respect the fact that the volunteers keep things on a tight leash and I don't expect to be treated like somebody special. I may not approve of the rules that some range masters enforce, but I applaud their responsibility.
Third, they do something that no other range does well - they educate. Education is the primary purpose of the facility, and in my opinion, it's sorely needed. I especially like the careful attention they give to youth.
First, the Center is staffed by volunteers. Volunteerism, especially when it comes to promoting shooting sports, gets my unequivocal support. Know who your friends are, folks.
Second, as a public facility (NOT a business), that promotes shooting sports, safety must be their first priority and they absolutely cannot rely on the public's common sense or firearms experience. But at the same time, they have to deal with a lot of attitude. I respect the fact that the volunteers keep things on a tight leash and I don't expect to be treated like somebody special. I may not approve of the rules that some range masters enforce, but I applaud their responsibility.
Third, they do something that no other range does well - they educate. Education is the primary purpose of the facility, and in my opinion, it's sorely needed. I especially like the careful attention they give to youth.
Well I guess we all know that you'll be wearing a khaki button up shirt with a plastic badge, and a pair of Carhartt jeans as an old man. I guess that is another option to go along with either a blue apron (Lowes) or an orange apron (Home Depot) during the retirement years. :lolbang:Kemo Sabe said:
I am just teasing you, not trying to start a brawl with you. This whole post is simply just about the experiences I have had at Lee Kay, and many others share my same sentiments. We are not bad people, we are law abiding tax payers, that are unhappy with a public (tax funded) service that is being provided.Kemo Sabe said:
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I haven't yet been to Lee-Kay so I can't talk from experience... I *AM*, however, going there this Friday with a buddy so we'll see how it goes...
... however, several people here have indicated that they run their range like "nazi's" (which I took to mean similar to how the military runs their shooting events... plenty of yelling and getting in your butt). I asked this of my buddy (who HAS shot there) and he confirmed it but said he just brushes it off b/c he's used to being yelled at (he's Marine, I'm a Sailor... both get yelled at but I think the Marines learn to actually LIKE it!
-- anyways... if that turns out to be my experience I will not be returning to Lee Kay. I find yelling at someone while they are operating a firearm to be counter-productive (unless it is absolutely necessary). As example, in the Navy it was a very common sight to see new shooters with trigger-control problems placing their firearm safely down-range but inadvertently placing their finger in the trigger guard before they were told to "fire". Then they would promptly get yelled at. Yelling at such a shooter only serves to make them nervous and only increases the odds of an AD... unless they are doing something actually STUPID such as muzzling someone or waving the gun around instead of keeping it down-range, shooters should NOT be yelled at.
Just my $0.02... I really HOPE it's not like that, but I'm not holding my breath...
P.S.: This was meant in response to the argument that Lee Kay emphasizes safety... unnecessarily yelling at someone does NOT teach safety and in fact is COUNTER-productive to safety.
... however, several people here have indicated that they run their range like "nazi's" (which I took to mean similar to how the military runs their shooting events... plenty of yelling and getting in your butt). I asked this of my buddy (who HAS shot there) and he confirmed it but said he just brushes it off b/c he's used to being yelled at (he's Marine, I'm a Sailor... both get yelled at but I think the Marines learn to actually LIKE it!
-- anyways... if that turns out to be my experience I will not be returning to Lee Kay. I find yelling at someone while they are operating a firearm to be counter-productive (unless it is absolutely necessary). As example, in the Navy it was a very common sight to see new shooters with trigger-control problems placing their firearm safely down-range but inadvertently placing their finger in the trigger guard before they were told to "fire". Then they would promptly get yelled at. Yelling at such a shooter only serves to make them nervous and only increases the odds of an AD... unless they are doing something actually STUPID such as muzzling someone or waving the gun around instead of keeping it down-range, shooters should NOT be yelled at.Just my $0.02... I really HOPE it's not like that, but I'm not holding my breath...
P.S.: This was meant in response to the argument that Lee Kay emphasizes safety... unnecessarily yelling at someone does NOT teach safety and in fact is COUNTER-productive to safety.
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OK....you have to take their yelling with a grain of salt.
Think about the atmosphere at LeeKay and how it differs from an INDOOR range. At an indoor range, you each have your own shooting lane and retractable target and can shoot as many rounds as you want and as fast as you want.
Since LeeKay is an OUTDOOR range, and is paid for by the State of Utah, and does not have the luxury of retractable targets, there is no choice but to run the pistol range like they do. You HAVE to have a ceasefire every 15 minutes in order to change targets, because everyone has to do it at the SAME time. And everyone is walking into the direct line-of-fire. If they didn't run it the way they do, there would be a chance for some seriously dangerous situations.
The rifle range, however, is totally different. Since the target area is accessible from a concrete pit, there is never a need for a ceasefire, nor the necessity of extreme safety measures, like on the pistol range.
Think about the atmosphere at LeeKay and how it differs from an INDOOR range. At an indoor range, you each have your own shooting lane and retractable target and can shoot as many rounds as you want and as fast as you want.
Since LeeKay is an OUTDOOR range, and is paid for by the State of Utah, and does not have the luxury of retractable targets, there is no choice but to run the pistol range like they do. You HAVE to have a ceasefire every 15 minutes in order to change targets, because everyone has to do it at the SAME time. And everyone is walking into the direct line-of-fire. If they didn't run it the way they do, there would be a chance for some seriously dangerous situations.
The rifle range, however, is totally different. Since the target area is accessible from a concrete pit, there is never a need for a ceasefire, nor the necessity of extreme safety measures, like on the pistol range.
I have a membership at the Holladay Gun Club, and have shot there since I was a little kid. You should give it a try and see how things are operated there, I am just sad that it will be closing in order to sale the homes for a housing devolopment after it is mined for gravel. :crying:
I've not commented in this thread until now. Again, I have been a volunteer there since 1989, and have met a good share of you. although I haven't known it. The pistol range procedures have been established to have a safe range, but when a better way of doing things is found, it is adopted. There is no alternative but to have cease fires to allow shooters to post targets. There is no alternative before a cease fire but to check the weapons visually and individually before people walk downrange. This is just common sense, and 15 minute relays seems to work the best. The biggest point of contention currently is to have everyone wear hearing and eye protection while on the range. Go figure. This was mandated by the Federal Government as a condition of funding.
As to the yelling, hey we're all different. There are also different levels of proficiency between r.o.'s We work hard to train the new guys and gals and get them up to speed. Some make it, some don't. Some of the r.o.'s have a quiet, easygoing personality, some don't. When range commands are given over the p.a. system, they are range commands, not range suggestions. They are to be given in a firm manner. While people are downrange, it just makes sense than no one can handle a weapon at the bench. You do, you will be told about it, you do it twice, you will really be told about it. If there is a safety problem, it must be handled NOW. If I am 30 feet away, I will yell. Then when things settle down, a few quiet words one on one ususally resolves the situation.
Yes, it's different than going to the desert. You are among a group of total strangers of varying levels of proficiency. It is the staff's job to even the playing field and maintain safety. I know this is infuriating to master shooters, but there is no other way.
Since this is a government run facility, it is held by law to a much higher standard of safe operation. The lawyers would just love to get a client with a case against the State of Utah.
One more item. The Kay Center is run by the Law Enforcement arm of the DWR. As such, there are legal ramifications to everything said or done on the facility.
As to the yelling, hey we're all different. There are also different levels of proficiency between r.o.'s We work hard to train the new guys and gals and get them up to speed. Some make it, some don't. Some of the r.o.'s have a quiet, easygoing personality, some don't. When range commands are given over the p.a. system, they are range commands, not range suggestions. They are to be given in a firm manner. While people are downrange, it just makes sense than no one can handle a weapon at the bench. You do, you will be told about it, you do it twice, you will really be told about it. If there is a safety problem, it must be handled NOW. If I am 30 feet away, I will yell. Then when things settle down, a few quiet words one on one ususally resolves the situation.
Yes, it's different than going to the desert. You are among a group of total strangers of varying levels of proficiency. It is the staff's job to even the playing field and maintain safety. I know this is infuriating to master shooters, but there is no other way.
Since this is a government run facility, it is held by law to a much higher standard of safe operation. The lawyers would just love to get a client with a case against the State of Utah.
One more item. The Kay Center is run by the Law Enforcement arm of the DWR. As such, there are legal ramifications to everything said or done on the facility.
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Rufus, my hat is off to you for volunteering at the range so that people can learn to shoot in a safe environment. :thumbsup:
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