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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just wanted to hear some of your thoughts on gun registration.

I recently read this really interesting article at http://www.firearmsandliberty.com/cramer.haynes.html titled "The Fifth Amendment, Self-Incrimination, and Gun Registration".

Basically it says (in a nutshell) that firearm registration only hurts the law-abiding citizens because it has been ruled that felons don't need to register their guns (in order to protect their 5th amendment right to not self-incriminate). The article also mentions that mandatory firearm registration is one of the first steps in a slow movement to eventually outright ban guns. My favorite quote from the article:

It sounds paranoid to suggest that gun registration records might be used in the future to confiscate guns ... but when we examine how the courts have crippled gun registration laws so that felons are effectively exempt, and only law-abiding citizens need to fear such laws, what other explanation can there be for the continuing plea for mandatory gun registration?
What are your thoughts? As for me, I DO MIND registering my gun. Gun registration really annoys me. Inside, I feel like my natural (God-given) rights (of privacy, etc) are being violated when I register a gun during a purchase from a dealer. (However, I DO obey said gun registration laws ... I don't buy any guns on the black market or anything.) I am in no way advocating breaking gun registration laws.
 

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As I understand things, and as has been affirmed in several other posts on this site, Utah has no gun registration laws.
This in no way means that there is no record of a purchase with the business with whom you may have purchased a weapon.
This also means that should the illegal and hypocritical BATFE decide to do something, such as go after someone for their guns,
that they couldn't look into the records of these dealers in order to find you.
That said, there is no current obligation ( as far as I am aware) To do anything other than provide a receipt for any private transaction
with a private citizen. Of course though, any criminal out there is not going to care about the law, whether the law is legal and constitutional, or not.
They will purchase or steal what they want on the black market or from a home or person with no thought for you or the law/constitution.
 

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Cinhil said:
That said, there is no current obligation ( as far as I am aware) To do anything other than provide a receipt for any private transaction with a private citizen.
I don't think there's any requirement of a receipt, either. Lots of private sellers ask you to sign a bill of sale so that if the gun is used in a crime and traced to them they can prove that it's not theirs any more, but that's not a legal requirement.
 

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swillden said:
Cinhil said:
That said, there is no current obligation ( as far as I am aware) To do anything other than provide a receipt for any private transaction with a private citizen.
I don't think there's any requirement of a receipt, either. Lots of private sellers ask you to sign a bill of sale so that if the gun is used in a crime and traced to them they can prove that it's not theirs any more, but that's not a legal requirement.
Yep, that's what I do. It keeps me safe!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Just want to verify...

You're saying that even gun dealers don't have any legal requirements to register guns they sell, in Utah?
 

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eddified said:
Just want to verify...

You're saying that even gun dealers don't have any legal requirements to register guns they sell, in Utah?
Yep, there is no statute on the books for Registration of Guns in Utah. The only requirements are what BATFE chooses to enforce upon the owner of a shop, this does not include registration, just compliance with law and their idiotic and hypocritical Rules.
 
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When you purchase a firearm you complete form 4473 which is then stored by the FFL or sent to the ATF if the FFL eventually gives up the license. The ATF cannot find out if or what you own. They can find out who purchased a given firearm by querying the manufacturer who then reports the FFL to whom the firearm was transfered, they would then have a 4473 on file for that firearm.
 
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Cinhil said:
This also means that should the illegal and hypocritical BATFE decide to do something, such as go after someone for their guns,
that they couldn't look into the records of these dealers in order to find you.
If you ask me, the BATFE is hypocritical anyway. And I still wonder what legal sorcery they need to employ in order to call it "legal"
 
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