Open carry
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You can't! There aren't any!mr_blove said:
No, seriously. Open carry is legal because there are no laws making it illegal. The best reference is in Utah Code U.C.A. 76-10-505:
76-10-505. Carrying loaded firearm in vehicle or on street.
(1) Unless otherwise authorized by law, a person may not carry a loaded firearm:
(a) in or on a vehicle;
(b) on any public street; or
(c) in a posted prohibited area.
(2) A violation of this section is a class B misdemeanor.
Part 1 (unless otherwise authorized by law) means law enforcement or having a concealed firearm permit. Loaded by definition in code means taking less than two actions to fire the weapon (semi-auto unloaded = empty tube, full mag; revolver unloaded = hammer over empty cylinder and upcoming cylinder empty).
So, if you are a CFP holder you are exempt from this section, you may therefore carry a loaded firearm in your vehicle, on a public street, etc. There is nothing in the code requiring a permit holder to conceal their weapon.
Please let me know if this was sufficient or if you want more info.
I highly recommend picking up a copy of Utah Gun Law by Attorney Mitch Vilos. You can get one at Doug's or FBMG along with numerous other gun stores.
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There is a list of codes pertaining to concealed carry on this site. It is all available on the Utah State site, and in Mitch Vilos' book, but here it is anyways:
http://www.utahconcealedcarry.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2227
http://www.utahconcealedcarry.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=2227
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You won't find any laws in the Utah statutes that talk about open-carry of a firearm.
There are laws that say you cannot carry a loaded firearm without a CFP. With a CFP, however, you can indeed carry a loaded firearm. The statutes never say that it has to be concealed.
The basic philosophy of open carry is that since it is not illegal, it is legal. Some people mock a statement like that, but that just shows that they do not understand law and liberty. We don't need politicians to pass laws to make things legal so that we can do them. Politicians pass laws to restrict what we can do. If there is no law prohibiting a thing, then that thing is legal.
Some pro-gun legislators attempted to clarify in the statutes that there is no requirement to conceal a firearm. That bill got hijacked by a RINO who turned it around with an amendment to say just the opposite, that the firearm had to be concealed. We had a close-call, almost losing some freedom there, but the sponsor killed the bill.
Check out the threads concerning recent bills in the legislature.
There are laws that say you cannot carry a loaded firearm without a CFP. With a CFP, however, you can indeed carry a loaded firearm. The statutes never say that it has to be concealed.
The basic philosophy of open carry is that since it is not illegal, it is legal. Some people mock a statement like that, but that just shows that they do not understand law and liberty. We don't need politicians to pass laws to make things legal so that we can do them. Politicians pass laws to restrict what we can do. If there is no law prohibiting a thing, then that thing is legal.
Some pro-gun legislators attempted to clarify in the statutes that there is no requirement to conceal a firearm. That bill got hijacked by a RINO who turned it around with an amendment to say just the opposite, that the firearm had to be concealed. We had a close-call, almost losing some freedom there, but the sponsor killed the bill.
Check out the threads concerning recent bills in the legislature.
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Initially, after I had actually read all of the Utah state laws regarding firearms, I was 99.9999% certain the law allowed for OC. However, I wasn't certain that our gov't reps could be convinced of that (judges, legislature, etc). Turns out I was wrong.
Here is an AWESOME LINK hosted at the Utah State Senate site. It contains Senate debates and hearing regarding HB 473 (which was an attempt to better clarify that CC'ers aren't required to CC). On that site you will find a section titled "Audio Recordings". You can click on the actual audio recordings of our Senators and other high-level government reps talking about OC and CC laws and hear the actual debates.
The recording for this bill that best explains the Utah state govt's understanding of CC and OC laws is the one labeled "House Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice Committee 2/18". It's over an hour long and I only listened to about the first 15min. It really just reinforces what has been said in this thread and numerous others but it is great to hear this stuff "from the horses' mouth" (namely, from the Atty General). The part that was most interesting were his comments about the legality of Open-Carry in the State. He does a very good job of explaining the whole idea of why OC is legal in Utah (the notion of "if it isn't illegal, it's legal).
Here is an AWESOME LINK hosted at the Utah State Senate site. It contains Senate debates and hearing regarding HB 473 (which was an attempt to better clarify that CC'ers aren't required to CC). On that site you will find a section titled "Audio Recordings". You can click on the actual audio recordings of our Senators and other high-level government reps talking about OC and CC laws and hear the actual debates.
The recording for this bill that best explains the Utah state govt's understanding of CC and OC laws is the one labeled "House Law Enforcement and Criminal Justice Committee 2/18". It's over an hour long and I only listened to about the first 15min. It really just reinforces what has been said in this thread and numerous others but it is great to hear this stuff "from the horses' mouth" (namely, from the Atty General). The part that was most interesting were his comments about the legality of Open-Carry in the State. He does a very good job of explaining the whole idea of why OC is legal in Utah (the notion of "if it isn't illegal, it's legal).
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Was at Harmon's in Roy today (OCing), as I was checking out the cashier asked if I was a cop, I said no. Then why do you have a gun, I told her that Utah Law permitted me to. She said that was scary, I asked why? I told her that anyone 18 years or older can OC in Utah, but not fully loaded, but if you have a CCW you can carry fully loaded. She asked if mine was fully loaded, I told her yes. Again she said that is scary. I asked why, she said she does not like guns. I tolded her what if someone came in and robbed you, she said she would freak out. I told her that at least I could protect myself and anyone with me, if threaten or shot at. She said that would be good. So I went on my way.
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Harmons was the first store that I had some excitement at. Especially the one in West Valley City :dancing:Shaolin said:
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Looks like I need to pick up that book, but until then I have a quick question. If OC is legal then is it okay for me to transport my gun in my car with a full mag with nothing in the pipe? Also, where do I have to store it in the car so it's not concealed? Thanks for the help!
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Thanks!
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Passenger seat or dashboard is the best place.
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I'm gonna try to install a Serpa holster on my dash. This way it's secure. Probably going to the harware store tonight to get stuff. Hopefully I can have it done for the Meetxmirage2kx said:
TJ
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Ah, but don't forget to not drive through a school zone if you are carrying like this if you don't have a CFP.PW said:
With a CFP, we can carry in school zones, even inside the schools. However, without a CFP, you have no such protection from the Federal Gun Free School Zone Act.
Keep that in mind...
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So what law wins State or Federal? (Fed: No unless licensed by the state you are in, or going hunting, or locked up) or (State 76-10-505.5-3-D-ii: School zone does not apply if "in any vehicle lawfully under the person's control")Jeff Johnson said:
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Federal law usually trumps state law. The thing about federal law is that local law enforcement only has to enforce local laws. They have a hard enough time keeping track of all of those, so they won't bust you on federal stuff - and there aren't feds running around enforcing for the most part.xmirage2kx said:
It seems clear to me, though... you can't carry in a school zone "unless licensed by the state you are in". As someone said above, without a CCW, don't do it.
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