Utah Guns Forum banner
1 - 20 of 25 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,614 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
On the Bob Lonsberry show this morning (570 am) they're reporting that the SJ PD and 4 of the 5 council members are supportive of a new ordinance that would make it a misdomeaner to use a BB gun, airsoft gun, archery equipment and a plethora of other 'fake guns' in the city limits... :disgusted:

[EDIT - Corrected URL tags so that they work -- Jeff]
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
3,195 Posts
Yes, I watched the hyperbolic, very seriously reported news feed on this last night. It is utterly contemptuous. It appears that it has become an issue more because of one school in the area and their fallible fear of anything that semi-appears to look like a weapon. In fact every one of these Airsoft guns they showed were easily seen for what they are (even if the orange end were painted). The experts quoted, or comments shown were from idiots except for the one council woman who states it would violate constitutional rights and would only be a beginning of more "legislation" to monitor our every move. Or in other words, it would begin the creation of so many rules that we couldn't use a bathroom without someone holding our hand because we were doing it wrong!
Personally I think it does violate constitutional rights as well as state law should they move forward with this idiocy. In fact, I felt it was another way the media could instill fear in the public as another way to accomplish their anti-gun agenda.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
I heard about this yesterday on my way home from work. To quote the great Glenn Beck, "it made BLOOD SHOOT OUT OF MY EYES". My favorite part of the story was the reporter stating that the police department was pushing for a requirement of all citizens to CALL THEM FIRST before they play with their toy guns. WHAT THE ?!?!?!?!?!?!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,614 Posts
Discussion Starter · #4 ·
And of course if they get this passed the PD will have carte blanche to harass everybody they see with a gun, fake or not...

:evil:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
8,757 Posts
Ruger Collector said:
And of course if they get this passed the PD will have carte blanche to harass everybody they see with a gun, fake or not...
Hmmm. Would seeing a man with a holstered gun give reasonable suspicion that the gun is a toy, and that the carrier is about to draw and shoot it? I don't think so.

Although open carry of firearms is rare, in my experience it's even less common for adults to walk around with toy guns strapped to their hips. In fact, I've never seen it. Even kids rarely carry an airsoft or BB gun in a holster. About the only holstered toys I ever see are on kids under 8, with their cap-gun "revolvers" in the obviously toy holsters they came with.

Not only that, how does seeing a holstered gun (fake or real) provide a reasonable suspicion that the carrier is about to draw and shoot? It's already illegal to shoot a firearm in the city.

Not that they wouldn't try to use this law to stop OC'ers, if it passes they will, but if anyone bothered to fight it I think a court would likely rule that it was an unjustified detention.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,614 Posts
Discussion Starter · #6 ·
swillden said:
Not that they wouldn't try to use this law to stop OC'ers, if it passes they will, but if anyone bothered to fight it I think a court would likely rule that it was an unjustified detention.
If it passes and somebody bothers to fight it in court the unconstitutional law will likely be quickly overturned as well. But why wait until then to fight a bad law when it might be nipped in the bud? I'd rather somebody not be forced to suffer the initial injustice.

Edit: The city council has this on the agenda for the public hearing June 17th @ 6pm. Unless my work schedule changes I'll be there to voice my opinion. Those who can't make it may send comment to the council members (whose contact information may be found at www.southjordancity.org ) or you can send written comments to the city recorder prior to the public hearing.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
19 Posts
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and it sounds like this perhaps extends a bit further, but isn't it usually against the law to discharge any firearm within city limits? I know my neighbor, who is a Lehi City police officer, and I were talking about the stupid squirrels we have in the neighborhood and we told him we were popping them with a pellet gun and he said "technically" we weren't supposed to be doing that. He also included the kids airsoft guns in this grouping. Of course, all of our neighborhood kids, including his, are constantly having airsoft wars, so I know he wouldn't do anything about it, but it was my common understanding that bb pellet and airsoft type guns were included in the no discharge of firearms in city limits rulings. Toy guns that don't actually fire anything out of the gun, thats a bit crazy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,614 Posts
Discussion Starter · #8 ·
mcmeister said:
Forgive me if I'm wrong, and it sounds like this perhaps extends a bit further, but isn't it usually against the law to discharge any firearm within city limits? I know my neighbor, who is a Lehi City police officer, and I were talking about the stupid squirrels we have in the neighborhood and we told him we were popping them with a pellet gun and he said "technically" we weren't supposed to be doing that. He also included the kids airsoft guns in this grouping. Of course, all of our neighborhood kids, including his, are constantly having airsoft wars, so I know he wouldn't do anything about it, but it was my common understanding that bb pellet and airsoft type guns were included in the no discharge of firearms in city limits rulings.
Those could be classified as dangerous weapons depending on how they are used or intended to be used (76-10-501.5), to be a firearm by UT law it would have to fire a projectile by means of an explosive.

Unless there is a specific local prohibition on BB/airsoft guns, its perfectly legal for your kids to be playing Army or shooting pop cans in your front yard with them, they're not discharging firearms.

76-10-501.9(a) Definitions[/URL]":1nxkoy5x]

(9) (a) "Firearm" means a pistol, revolver, shotgun, sawed-off shotgun, rifle or sawed-off rifle, or any device that could be used as a dangerous weapon from which is expelled a projectile by action of an explosive.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,528 Posts
Did anyone else here participate in two-pump wars? This was well before paint ball or air soft; we would use our pellet guns with a two pump limit to fight battles on the city streets. Guess we've come a long way since then.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
20 Posts
LOLOLOLOLOL TWO PUMP LIMIT!!!! That's funny. You know when nobody was looking you were pumping that pellet gun beyond its limits. I know I did.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,528 Posts
mjhuff51 said:
LOLOLOLOLOL TWO PUMP LIMIT!!!! That's funny. You know when nobody was looking you were pumping that pellet gun beyond its limits. I know I did.
Yup! :twisted: "He's a little farther away than usual."
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
Ruger Collector said:
Unless there is a specific local prohibition on BB/airsoft guns, its perfectly legal for your kids to be playing Army or shooting pop cans in your front yard with them, they're not discharging firearms.
There is indeed precedent set in other states which said that paintball guns are NOT firearms. It was pre-airsoft era, but I believe it would hold up also... barring local specific city regulations, of course.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,528 Posts
My sister & family live in South Jordan and were up visiting today when this topic came up. Since some special discussion on the subject was scheduled for their June 17th council meeting, has anyone heard any new info or if any decision was made?
 
G

·
Ruger Collector said:
... make it a misdomeaner to use a BB gun, airsoft gun, archery equipment and a plethora of other 'fake guns' in the city limits...
:ROFL:

South Jordan Agenda...
1. Threaten to make toys illegal
2. Take bribes from the toy companies
3. ....
4. Profit!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
I had a friend attend the South Jordan city council meeting. The city said they were postponing the vote on the issue until they could further investigate the legal ramifications of making such an action. There were a few people there to oppose the nonsense. No definitive action of schedule of action was proposed.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
43 Posts
It looks like this may be heating up again:

http://www.ksl.com/index.php?nid=148&sid=3928868

South Jordan proposes restrictions on fake firearms
August 4th, 2008 @ 8:57am

SALT LAKE CITY (AP) -- Air-powered guns -- like paintball rifles and BB guns -- could soon be banned on the streets of South Jordan.

The City Council is considering an ordinance to restrict the use of fake firearms to private property. The proposal follows 15 police department complaints of air guns mistaken for real weapons and 30 cases of property damage.

Under the proposal, air guns would be banned from public streets and property. Gun owners also would be required to keep fired BBs and paintballs from landing in restricted areas, including another person's property.

South Jordan wouldn't be the first municipality to impose restrictions. Salt Lake City, Bountiful, Clearfield and Centerville all prohibit firing the weapons within cities limits unless its at an approved hunting area or shooting range.

------

Information from: The Salt Lake Tribune
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,614 Posts
Discussion Starter · #19 ·
What nonsense, I can walk down the street with a REAL gun openly strapped to my hip and be perfectly legal, but if my kid is walking with me with a toy gun he's breaking the law! Time to encourage State legislators to cover these items under preemption.. :bang2:
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,091 Posts
Sometimes you wonder about our elected officials, and those that keep reelecting them. :dunno: :dunno:
 
1 - 20 of 25 Posts
Top