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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I once witnessed one driver break the window of the car ahead of him and pull the driver out and beat him to the ground --blood was flying, this was at stopped intersection. Major road rage.

Would it have been legal for me or another CCW holder to draw our weapon and potential stop this person from being beaten to death?

I know there are lots of variables here but NO ONE was helping this guy and i mean BLOOD WAS FLYING, the agressor PUNCHED his way through the window to get to the driver.

-Rob
 

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RobFindlay said:
Would it have been legal for me or another CCW holder to draw our weapon and potential stop this person from being beaten to death?

-Rob
Legal? YES.... i dont have time to look up the utah state code but someone else may.
 

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There was another post a week or two ago that says if we fear for our well being or anothers (From bodily harm and/or death) then we can act upon. I'm not a lawyer, but let me see if I can find the post.
 

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According to Utah State Code 76-2-402: Force in defense of person -- Forcible felony defined. you are allowed to use a firearm "only if he or she reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to himself or a third person as the result of the other's imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony."

So, yes you could use a firearm in this situation.

You should head over to Doug's Shoot 'n Sports and buy a copy of Mitch Vilos' Utah Gun Law With Plain Talk Summaries. It's a great book and a resource I use often to answer questions on this forum.
 

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To begin with, the usual disclaimer: I am not a lawyer!

U.C.A. 76-2-402

[1] A person is justified in threatening or using force against another when and to the extent that he or she reasonably believes that force is necessary to defend himself or a third person against such other's imminent use of unlawful force. However, that person is justified in using force intended or likely to cause death or serious bodily injury only if he or she reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to himself or a third person as a result of the other's imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

[4] ...Any other felony offense which involves the use of force or violence against a person so as to create a substantial danger of death or serious bodily injury also constitutes a forcible felony. Burglary of a vehicle... does not constitute a forcible felony except when the vehicle is occupied at the time unlawful entry is made or attempted.

So, legal? Yes. One guy unlawfully made entry to a vehicle while it was occupied (forcible felony). The guy then continued to use unlawful force to cause serious bodily injury (forcible felony). You would have been justified using deadly force if you reasonably believed that there was an imminent threat , and if you did not act the man could have been seriously injured or killed. You still need to be cautious that you do not become the aggressor.

I, however, would not begin with drawing down on the man. Drawing down for me is a last resort.

Hope this answers your question.
 

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GeneticsDave said:
You should head over to Doug's Shoot 'n Sports and buy a copy of Mitch Vilos' Utah Gun Law With Plain Talk Summaries. It's a great book and a resource I use often to answer questions on this forum.
:agree: Anyone who carries should have a copy of this book.
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Stenny4 said:
GeneticsDave said:
You should head over to Doug's Shoot 'n Sports and buy a copy of Mitch Vilos' Utah Gun Law With Plain Talk Summaries. It's a great book and a resource I use often to answer questions on this forum.
:agree: Anyone who carries should have a copy of this book.
Got it......BOY i don't agree with alot of his rhetoric, but his plain-talk sections are clear and extremely helpful so it was a good buy.
 

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Definitely a awesome/informative book.
 

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My brother did that exact thing, he witnessed a man run a woman off the road (freeway) run into her car, grab her out of it and start to beat her, my brother pulled his weapon called 911 and held him there untill police arrived, other than it being a very long night for him, he never got into one bit of trouble and was even comended on his actions for saving the womans life, he had caught her cheating on him and told her he was going to kill her.

This happened on the highway coming out of weber canyon just west of the toll road.
 

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The problem is most fist fights do not qualify for serious bodily injury. Most fights result in a fat lip, a bruise and a bloody nose . . . that is not serious bodily injury. So unless know it is going to escalate further, you aren't justified introducing lethal force.

The other problem with these situations is you generally don't know the cause of the fight and who escalated what. You generally want to come to the aid of some innocent; however, you may be inserting yourself in a situation where the guilty person is being beatened. Perhaps they have a knife and they person beating them was simply defending themselves legally.
 

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marksman said:
Where is a good place in Utah county to get Mitch's book?
I bought ours at Gunnie's on the corner of State St. and 4th South in Orem.
 

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aashooter said:
The problem is most fist fights do not qualify for serious bodily injury. Most fights result in a fat lip, a bruise and a bloody nose . . . that is not serious bodily injury. So unless know it is going to escalate further, you aren't justified introducing lethal force.

The other problem with these situations is you generally don't know the cause of the fight and who escalated what. You generally want to come to the aid of some innocent; however, you may be inserting yourself in a situation where the guilty person is being beatened. Perhaps they have a knife and they person beating them was simply defending themselves legally.
I agree with what aashooter said above in general situations like a bar fight or such. However, in this situation, you would be completely within your rights to draw. The one who initiated the contact (broke the window and began beating the other person) could be innocent or guilty (same as the beaten) with whatever the underlying reason was for the aggression. The fact that he had the opportunity to avoid the situation (drive elsewhere) and that he broke into the other car and extracted the passenger makes him guilty of aggravated assault.
 
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