[heavykevy]

Hmmm....since it has something to do with Mayor Bloomberg this change is likely not for the best (not that tracking gun purchases is a good thing anyway).

Wal-Mart to film gun sales in bid to fight crime

2 hours, 11 minutes ago

Wal-Mart Stores Inc, the world's largest retailer, unveiled plans on Monday to film its gun sales in the United States and create a computerized log of purchases in a bid to stop guns falling into the wrong hands.

Wal-Mart, which is the largest seller of firearms in the United States, agreed a 10-point code, which also includes rigid inventory controls, with a bipartisan coalition of Mayors Against Illegal Guns led by New York's Michael Bloomberg.

The retailer said it will develop a first-of-its-kind computerized crime gun trace log that will flag purchases by customers who have previously bought guns later recovered in crimes.

"Wal-Mart currently uses a strong point of sale system," said J.P. Suarez, senior vice president and chief compliance officer of Wal-Mart. "This code is a way for us to fine-tune the things we're already doing and further strengthen our standards. We hope other retailers will join us."

The Responsible Firearms Retailer Partnership is designed to strengthen the points in the gun purchasing system that criminals have exploited in the past, Wal-Mart and the Mayors Against Illegal Guns said.

According to the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, 46 percent of its criminal gun trafficking investigations involved cases in which someone who is not legally allowed to purchase a firearm does so through the use of a proxy, known as a straw buyer.

(Reporting by Michelle Nichols; editing by Mohammad Zargham)

LINK TO STORY

 

[Paul]

Guess I won't be buying guns from Wal-Mart....O oops wait, I don't anyway.....

I must say that at least I can boycott Wal-Mart. You can't really boycott the government.

 

[mchlwise]

:shock:

I see no reason why a private corporation should have more information about gun possession than the government does.

:nilly:

 

[Paul]

:shock:

I see no reason why a private corporation should have more information about gun possession than the government does.

:nilly:

I don't either.

Just remember that you don't have to deal with any private corporation. The bottom line will speak clear enough to them. If the government requires this they really don't care what you think and you usually have no other option but to comply.

 

[Shaolin]

Do they actually sell anything good over there, as is guns?

 

[apollosmith]

I see no reason why a private corporation should have more information about gun possession than the government does.

That there is the problem. If the private corporation has the information, the government can get it pretty much whenever they want.

I wonder how long before this 'registry' will extend to ammo and hunting supplies, etc.

 

[GeneticsDave]

Ok, here's what I don't get. Most people that use firearms violently, choose to use sidearms, not long guns and shotguns. Wal-Mart only sells long guns and shotguns (mostly the hunting type), so tell me how this will help stem violence with small arms... If anyone sees the logic in this, please share ('cause I sure don't).

:huh:

 

[Dustin WJ]

If anyone sees the logic in this, please share ('cause I sure don't).

:huh:

:dunno:

 

[rdoggsilva]

I do not buy my weapons at Wal-Mart so it will not effect me. But I do buy ammo from them. It sounds like they are caving in to the anti-gun groups like K-mart did. I do not buy from K-Mart because of this. Now it looks like I may quite buying from Wal-Mart also.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

I've never bought a gun from Walmart. Now I never will.
They still do have relatively good deals on WWB ammo.
I hope that they don't get stupid with that too.

 

[Paul]

I've never bought a gun from Walmart. Now I never will.
They still do have relatively good deals on WWB ammo.
I hope that they don't get stupid with that too.

:agree:

 

[Paul]

Just playing the devils advocate here, but why worry about it anyway.
You are probably already being taped buying the gun or ammo already. I'm pretty sure that Wally World has security cameras on the gun counter 24/7 already anyway. Really kind of sounds like what they are trying to do is keep guns out of the hands of people that shouldn't have them anyway. If the government wants to find out about a gun you bought, they can already anyway.

 

[mchlwise]

You are probably already being taped buying the gun or ammo already. I'm pretty sure that Wally World has security cameras on the gun counter 24/7 already anyway. Really kind of sounds like what they are trying to do is keep guns out of the hands of people that shouldn't have them anyway. If the government wants to find out about a gun you bought, they can already anyway.

There ARE already plenty of ways your actions are recorded. There are cameras in the parking lot, and your movements can be tracked from getting out of your car, to the gun counter, to buying whatever you buy. Your bank statements also track what you bought and when, and these can be correlated to sales at a particular store. But both of these things only happen if you go to the trouble to dig through the mountains of footage or statements. If you pay in cash, the bank statement trail can be eliminated all together.

The problem I have with their new policy is that it makes it much easier for them to track a specific gun to a specific person. As has been pointed out, that makes it much easier for the government or whoever to then go in and access that information.

Honestly, though, it's not the government that I'm worried about (at this point). They have guidelines and policies they have to follow, and judges who ensure that they do. To whom does WalMart answer to? Who holds them accountable for what they do with the information they collect? No one that I'm aware of.

I've personally got nothing to hide, if I did I wouldn't have bought my last 2 guns using my debit card, but I have real concerns with private companies stockpiling information on me. I don't shop at Smith's or have their "Fresh Values" card, for example, because I don't need them keeping lists of the kinds of things I like and what my habits are. :x

 

[althor]

The problem I have with their new policy is that it makes it much easier for them to track a specific gun to a specific person. As has been pointed out, that makes it much easier for the government or whoever to then go in and access that information.

Easier than it is with a Form 4473? I'm not sure how. It might help to cut down on 'straw' purchases, or ensure that proper ID is recorded or something else along those lines.

Either way, they're free to do so. It really doesn't matter to me as I don't shop there. But then I count days without shopping at walmart like others count days of sobriety.

 

[mchlwise]

Either way, they're free to do so. It really doesn't matter to me as I don't shop there. But then I count days without shopping at walmart like others count days of sobriety.

:lolbang:

 

[Paul]

To whom does WalMart answer to? Who holds them accountable for what they do with the information they collect? No one that I'm aware of.

They answer to shareholders, and by extension customers. Bottom line drives corporations.

 

[mchlwise]

They answer to shareholders, and by extension customers. Bottom line drives corporations.

True, but unfortunately, I don't think there is or is going to be enough outrage over this to affect their bottom line.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

The real issue I have with this is that they partnered with New York Mayor Michael Bloomberg's anti-gun coalition of mayors. They might as well partner with the Brady Bunch... :disgusted:

 

[caldweller]

I like what Wayne wrote about Bloomberg and Walmart's decisions,
"(It ) isn't about crime. It's about demonizing gun ownership in general...This reeks of a public relations stunt instead of a crime-fighting measure.

I will not only purchase guns and ammo elsewhere, but will buy my groceries somewhere else too. I believe it doesn't do any good to shop somewhere else unless I contact Walmart and let them know of my decision and the reason for it.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

Here is a good argument against letting this slide, written by Guns & Ammo Magazine writer, Dan Johnson (he's also the admin on the gun forum sponsored by Guns & Ammo Magazine):

Here's what every gun owner needs to understand about this. Wal-Mart is going beyond the law in this. They are in essence setting themselves up as law enforcement and infringing on our privacy and rights in a way even ATF is not allowed to do.

By law ATF cannot keep a searchable database of firearms sales, but Wal-Mart has decided they will and they will judge you a criminal without access to information the ATF does have.

This is not an issue to be shrugged off. If this does not incite gun owners to the level of outrage and willingness to boycott that the S&W deal with Clinton did then perhaps we are not the staunch defenders of gun rights we once were.

When a gun is used in a crime or otherwise needs to be traced here is how it works. ATF goes to the manufacturer, then the distributor, and then the retailer to search the sales log and find out who bought it. In most cases the person who bought the gun is not the person who used it in a crime. ATF does not share info gained in this investigation with retailers so Wal-Mart doesn't know if the purchaser is guilty of anything more than having the gun stolen or reselling it.

But with this new system in place Wal-Mart will assume anyone who purchased a gun and they later got a call from law enforcement about is a criminal and will, at the very least, refuse to sell you another, and it seems from what I have read will likely report you to the police. This is not responsible retailing. This is an irresponsible attempt at law enforcement and law making and a clear violation of customers' right to privacy and Constitution rights granted by the 2nd. Amendment.