[Jeff Johnson]

I've compared Utah gun laws to those of other states. I'd rate Utah as generally gun-friendly, with some notable exceptions. The purpose of this post is to raise the question of what improvements might we hope to make in Utah gun laws.

The exceptions to the gun-friendly laws that I can think of, and for which I'd like to see changes made, are:

1. Open carry: Utah law restricts open-carry in a squirrelly way. You can open-carry a technically unloaded handgun without a CFP (assuming you're legal to possess a gun at all). With a CFP, it is legal to open carry a technically loaded handgun. The definition of loaded is the squirrelly part. The gun is loaded if the actuation of any one mechanism, once, can cause the gun to fire. So a revolver must have the next chamber to rotate into firing position empty to be considered unloaded. An autoloader must have an empty chamber to be considered unloaded.
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2. Car carry. Only with a CFP can you carry a loaded gun within reach in a car (or available in the cabin of a car) in Utah. In many states, a car is considered somewhat of an extension of one's domicile. One is allowed to have the tools to defend oneself in the extended domicile without the requirement of a CFP. Why is that restricted in Utah?[/*]

As far as open-carry goes, I'm familiar with the arguments for and against it in a tactical sense (giving away the surprise in advance or perhaps just offending people). That's not the point I'm trying to raise here. Why should it be restricted by law, other than for unconstitutional gun-control?

In many states (including some that are much less gun-friendly), it is perfectly legal to open carry a loaded handgun without a permit. In fact, the open-carry marches in Ohio helped lead to the passage of their new right-to-carry law.

As far as car-carry goes, it is perfectly legal in many states even without a permit, although in some states the gun must be visible. Missouri's new right-to-carry law includes provisions that allow people without a permit to carry in their own cars for self-protection as long as they're old enough.

I'd like to see changes to Utah law. Open carry of a loaded handgun and car carry should be perfectly legal in Utah.

Opinions on these? Other desired changes?

 

[Guest]

Changes I'd like to see? Take all the gun laws and erase them from the books. Every single one of them. Gone.
That's what I'd like to see.
Legal concealed carry with no permit.
Legal open carry with no hassles.
I could roll from church to the UofU library and then take a walk through Liberty Park without having to talk to a Cop unless I wanted to ask for directions.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

I agree completely!

However, I'm asking for realistic changes that we can shoot for in the next legislative session. There's no possible way to roll back all the infringements at once. We have to work a step at a time.

So, what changes can we discuss and perhaps even plan for? Opinions

or

on my two initial suggestions? Any other suggestions?

 

[Guest]

I'm a SE Idaho resident, and the thing I'd be looking at is streamlining the permit process for Utah even more. Some of the disqualifiers are asinine - the crime of moral turpitude or any crime of violence in the past are a bit over the top. If you're ineligible to own a gun, fine...but the irony is that I can carry with my non-domestic regular ol' misdemeanor battery conviction in Utah on my Idaho permit. Place a time limit on these minor incidents like most states do - not a lifetime disqualifier.

I'd like a UT permit for travel purposes, but apparently a minor crime over a decade ago is too much. Guess my money will go to Florida instead.

 

[UtahRSO]

What we need first is for the laws that have been passed to be recognized and observed. As an example, the U of U should recognize the people, through their elected representatives, have said CFP holders can legally carry on campus.

It does no good to pass new laws while despots on the U campus refuse to observe the ones that already exist. It makes me want to walk around campus carrying openly, just to see their eyes pop. :roll:

 

[Jeff Johnson]

In case you are interested, I posted this same question to packing.org. The replies to that thread are also interesting.

In particular, things that were mentioned include:

1. going "Alaska Carry", which is better than "Vermont Carry" because the permit is still offered if a citizen wants reciprocity
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2. passing a law to protect the civil right to carry even at work --- to prevent another AOL-type case (3 employees at AOL in Ogden were fired because they were transferring guns from one car to another in order to go shooting)[/*]

It was also mentioned that we have to stay alert and vigilant to defend against the continuing onslaughts from [Un]safe to Learn/[Un]safe to Worship. I must agree with that. We cannot get complacent or we'll get steamrolled.

I've decided to be part of the solution instead of part of the problem. I've joined both the NRA (Life Member) and the Utah Shooting Sports Council.

 

[Jeff Johnson]

What we need first is for the laws that have been passed to be recognized and observed. As an example, the U of U should recognize the people, through their elected representatives, have said CFP holders can legally carry on campus ...

I quite agree. Utah Attorney General Mark Shurtleff has been a staunch supporter of the law, defending the law against the attacks from the U of U. I think that an important part of getting the U of U to comply with the law is to support the reelection of Mark Shurtleff to AG this fall.