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Re: 2017 Permit Free Carry, HB 112

PostPosted: Mon 23 Jan 2017 7:34 am
by manithree
UtahRSO wrote:This is a wonderful idea, and I hope this bill passes. But I can't see how it could work for some people, me included


You still need a permit to be excepted from the state and federal GFSZ laws. This bill is a step in the right direction, but not even a very practical alternative to a CFP along the Wasatch front, let alone approaching an end to the CFP process. It's more symbolic than practical, for now.

Re: 2017 Permit Free Carry, HB 112

PostPosted: Mon 23 Jan 2017 3:50 pm
by bagpiper
UtahRSO wrote:This is a wonderful idea, and I hope this bill passes. But I can't see how it could work for some people, me included. Having a permit exempts the holder from the Federal bill 1000 foot school situation. If I read this bill correctly, carrying concealed (or openly as we can do now) without a permit would not exempt us from that problem. From where I live, I can't drive any distance at all without passing a school, or two, or three. So what can be done about that? I know a bunch of other states have constitutional carry. How do they get around this problem? Perhaps I'm incorrect with the idea of 1000 feet. Does the Federal GFSZ apply only to actual school premises, and not for 1000 feet around the school?


You are right, the bill has no effect on the federal GFSZ law and its 1000' exclusion range. As such, this bill is unlikely to materially affect how many people apply for and retain carry permits in Utah.

Technically speaking, no States' constitutional / permit free carry statutes overcome the issue of the federal GFSZ law. However, as more and more States pass similar laws, demand to change the federal GFSZ law (perhaps by eliminating the 1000' exclusion range and going with only the actual school grounds themselves as Utah State law does) will mount. The federal courts will also sometimes look to State laws to see how various rights are currently understood. The Supreme Court did this very thing when it outlawed executing anyone who committed an otherwise capital offense while still a minor. A fair number of States had already outlawed such executions and the SCOTUS explicitly cited those State laws as one evidence that society now considered such executions as being cruel and unusual.

This bill is really a small, but important strategic advance. And it costs us nothing except the work to get it passed.

Charles

Re: 2017 Permit Free Carry, HB 112

PostPosted: Tue 15 Aug 2017 11:36 am
by Karl
And how did that all go?

Do you think it will be back?

Is there money available to throw at this again?

How do you think it will go next time? Any different than last time?

Why or why not?