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McKay Dee Hospital

4K views 4 replies 5 participants last post by  bagpiper 
#1 ·
I found myself at McKay Dee Hospital in Ogden today to take my wife in for a follow up visit for foot surgery she had last week. We went in through the doors and put her in one of the Hospital courtesy wheelchairs. I ran her scooter back out to the car since we didn't need it in the hospital. Went back in through the doors and got up to her appointment and then I realized I forgot something in the car. I ran back out to my car, got what I needed and then ran back in to the hospital to continue waiting with her for her appointment. Once we finished I wheeled her out in one of the hospital wheelchairs to our car and then when I returned the chair inside (my 4th trip in through these doors) noticed a "No weapons" sign on the door. I hadn't noticed the sign on the previous entries to the hospital since the sign is on the door and when the door opens it folds in half and the sign is completely covered by another sign.

My first thought is if you want to declare to be a "Weapon free" zone then you should post the sign so that it is not obscured when the door opens - especially when the door is automatic and opens as you approach. Due to the high amount of traffic in and out those doors I wouldn't be surprised if the doors are open more often than they are closed. I mean, what if a law abiding citizen walked in through the open doors with their concealed gun and did not see the sign? :shades:

As to my second thought of whether or not this is legal, Hospitals seems to be a gray area - if they deal with Mental Health, then I can see where they might be able to get away with prohibiting weapons, but as has been discussed before, this is probably something that could stand for some clarification in the laws.

Dave
 
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#2 ·
Signs such as what you saw have zero legal effect in Utah. They could threaten to trespass you but there is no gun infraction. If you were employed by them they could fire you over it.
As for the mental health part only the part that actually houses the patients can be a secure facility-- not the entire hospital. They would also have to provide secure storage for you.
You don't need to know what kind of device or tool was used to send this
 
#3 ·
:agree:
All of which Sparky said should have been clearly stated in your CFP class.

SUMMARY OF SECURED / PROHIBITED AREAS:
1. Airports secure areas.
2. Court secure areas.
3. Jail secure areas.
4. Post Offices.
5. Federal Buildings.
6. Correctional and mental health facilities.
7. A house of worship (after all posting and notification requirements have been met).
8. A private residence if notice is given (verbal/posted sign).
9. Any area designated secure or otherwise prohibited by state or federal law.
 
#4 ·
The sign is as irrelevant to law abiding citizens here in utah as all such signs are to criminals. The only area of a hospital where you couldnt legally carry would be the secure area of a mental health ward. For those that have never visited a person in such an area.. trust me you will know it when you see it. Generally there are locked doors, and a bank teller like window that you have to be buzzed through to visit anyone in the secure portion.
 
#5 ·
Dmc said:
As to my second thought of whether or not this is legal,
It is perfectly legal for them to post "No Guns" signs.

There is no criminal violation for ignoring the signs.

Since they are a private, not a government, employer, they can impose employment consequences including termination, for employees who violate their policies.

For customers or patients, I think even trespass would be a tough case for them to make. First they'd need to demonstrate your presence was intended to cause alarm, annoyance, or injury, or to commit some other crime. See Utah code 76-6-206. Then, they might have to deal with whether or not they had refused medical services to someone who was in need.

An openly carried gun might rise to the level of making trespass an issue under 76-6-206. But, I don't see how a concealed firearm could possibly meet that standard in the absence of overt intentions to commit some crime.

In order for a secure mental facility to actually be an off limits location with criminal penalties, the facility has to provide secure storage for your legally carried gun. No secure storage, no secure facility, no criminal violations for violating the policy. The only exception is the secure area of the airport which doesn't have to provide storage.

Court houses are not providing secure storage and so are not secure areas under statute. So, rather than being subject to a felony violation for violating court house no-gun zones, a person is subject to contempt of court.

I am not a lawyer, etc and so on.

Charles
 
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