Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

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Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby bumpylight » Thu 05 Jan 2017 1:15 pm

The quick thinking and apparent professionalism of the injured cop in this surveillance video of a 2016 Walmart shooting incident bear note. He expertly shoots and disables the chaotically fleeing suspect before rapidly returning to check on his partner, who evidently had also been shot multiple times. Yes, I know, it's Bob Owens, but he's just the messenger of a solid message about being prepared. For your convenience, a direct hyperlink to the YouTube video also appears below.

Police in Chandler, Arizona, have released surveillance footage from an April 2016 shootout that left two officers injured and the suspect dead.

On April 23, 2016, at around 6:21 a.m., Officers Joshua Pueblo and Daniel Colwell responded to a non-emergency call about a person trespassing at a Walmart store, police said.

Colwell arrived first and spoke with the suspect, whom police identified as Mitchell Oakley. Police said that shortly after Pueblo arrived, Oakley then shot both officers multiple times.

In the video footage, which shows multiple angles of the scene unfolding, officers can be seen talking with Oakley, who is seated in a chair in front of them. As Oakley stands up, he suddenly starts shooting as shoppers scatter.

Pueblo, 34, was shot three times — in the torso, arm and face, police said. Colwell, 29, was shot two or three times in the torso. The force of the bullets sent him flying through a display. But he was able to get back up and return fire, killing Oakley as he tried to run out of the store, according to police.

[....]


http://bearingarms.com/bob-o/2017/01/05 ... pect-dead/
https://youtube.com/watch?v=p4gykPZ6wlM
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby dewittdj » Thu 05 Jan 2017 1:43 pm

The force of the bullets sent him flying through a display. But he was able to get back up and return fire, killing Oakley as he tried to run out of the store, according to police.


Sheer buffoonery! The force of the bullets did not send him flying through a display. His quick reaction and rapid attempt to backpedal and get away resulted in him stumbling into and falling through the display.
:disgusted: Such shameless and inaccurate reporting.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby D-FIN » Thu 05 Jan 2017 2:16 pm

dewittdj wrote:
The force of the bullets sent him flying through a display. But he was able to get back up and return fire, killing Oakley as he tried to run out of the store, according to police.


Sheer buffoonery! The force of the bullets did not send him flying through a display. His quick reaction and rapid attempt to backpedal and get away resulted in him stumbling into and falling through the display.
:disgusted: Such shameless and inaccurate reporting.


I was thinking he exact same thing then noticed you already said it.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby bumpylight » Thu 05 Jan 2017 2:17 pm

I have to admit that my mind did momentarily pause over that bit, but the heck with it. It's possible to quibble that because the impact of the bullets presumably caused him to stumble and fall in an unsuccessful effort to recover his balance, the "force of the bullets" did technically "send him flying" ... yes, yes, it's gossamer thin, but I've long since given up on expecting accuracy from most reporters and commentators.

Magazines are "clips," thirty-round magazines are "banana clips," low-powered .223-caliber semi-automatic rifles with a military appearance are "deadly assault rifles," hollowpoint ammunition intended to protect innocents from pass-through bullets and to maximize stopping power against violent attackers are "banned dum-dum bullets," all ammunition is composed of "bullets" and not cartridges or rounds, ordinary scoped hunting rifles are "sniper rifles," and on and on. I'm sure most smart gun owners have their own lists of common media idiocies. I did warn the reader that this was Bob Owens. :roll:

dewittdj wrote:Sheer buffoonery! The force of the bullets did not send him flying through a display. His quick reaction and rapid attempt to backpedal and get away resulted in him stumbling into and falling through the display.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby Karl » Fri 06 Jan 2017 10:37 pm

Shooting stories get embellished by media writers in order to sound flashier. Nothing is surprising about that.

I always wonder what kind of firearm the shooter used. This detail is not given.

I am guessing it was some kind of mouse gun that the shooter had in his pocket.

I also wonder if the LEO's were wearing vests. If so it would have protected them from torso shots but obviously not from face or limb shots.

I'm surprised that the LEO's in this incident did not first frisk the suspect and tell him to keep his hands where they could see them. That might have saved them their gunshot injuries.

Drawing and shooting from open carry as in the case of police is about 1/2 second faster than from concealment, not to mention that the suspect must have put his hand(s) into his pocket(s) to draw out a firearm and start shooting it.

When someone sticks their hands in their pockets that is a very good time to either draw and shoot them first or to tackle them so they can't shoot.

With 2 LEO's on 1 suspect this should not have gone the way it went.

Having said all that I will confess that my sister always blasts me for blaming the victims. But normally there is something the victims of a shooting could have done to avoid getting shot -- normally. Keen situational awareness and pre-emptive action is normally what it takes.

I'm glad the 2 LEO's recovered. I am guessing that the mouse gun that the suspect used is why. I am guessing it was a 25 or 380 caliber firearm.

I'm glad the 1 LEO shot the suspect dead. That saved the county and state a lot of taxpayer money from having to prosecute and imprison him. LEO's are allowed to shoot at fleeing suspects. The rest of us who are not LEO's are not allowed to do that. Once a shooter starts to flee we are not supposed to shoot back at that point, unless they are heading in the direction of our family or friends. That's worth remembering.

I hope my thoughts do not offend anybody.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby bumpylight » Sat 07 Jan 2017 11:32 am

Technically, the cop shot the suspect dead after the suspect returned to the immediate vicinity and attempted to pick up the same weapon used just before then to shoot two people. The suspect presumably already had proven himself to be an imminent threat to life and limb. Admittedly, one never knows what might happen later with an overzealous or politically motivated prosecutor, but I'd think that even a civilian would be able to justify the shooting under those specific circumstances.

Karl wrote:[....]

[....] LEO's are allowed to shoot at fleeing suspects. The rest of us who are not LEO's are not allowed to do that. Once a shooter starts to flee we are not supposed to shoot back at that point, unless they are heading in the direction of our family or friends. That's worth remembering.

[....]


Furthermore, you're utterly right about the liberal mass media's routine embellishment and distortion of facts. Consider the following scenario:

A beat cop walks up to a disheveled individual who is acting erratically on a public sidewalk in a heavily trafficked area and who appears to have a large handgun hanging casually inside his belt in typical ghetto fashion. The cop is polite and professional even in this potentially dangerous situation. The erratic individual in question suddenly screams, "Bleep Trump! Kill Whitey!" The cop asks the erratic individual to take his hand away from his firearm. The erratic individual then lunges at the cop and pushes him to the ground before flashing his hand with blinding speed toward the partially concealed handgun. The cop desperately recovers poise from his nearly prone position and draws his own weapon in time to fire at the suspect as the suspect is popping off three rounds at the cop's chest, which fortunately is protected by a concealed ballistic vest. The suspect is apparently hopped up on some sort of psychoactive substance, and the cop ends up emptying the magazine of his 9mm Glock 22 department-issue semiautomatic into the suspect before the suspect finally collapses from a twirling, crazy dance that has his handgun describing unknown figures in the air. Paramedics arrive ten minutes later and pronounce the suspect dead at the scene. While paramedics attend to the injured cop, who has taken a grazing bullet wound to his upper left shoulder in addition to suffering two bruises under his ballistic vest, the cop smiles wanly at a friend who cracks a gallows-humor joke about puny bullets and tough cops.

Now, consider how a typical leftist vermin might paint this picture with the usual distortions and careful omissions of fact:

"Sancho Hernandez, an officer from the scandal-plagued East Jimboland department, approached Darien Fluffhead, who was known in the neighborhood as a gentle giant and a good father who sometimes gave gifts to his many children in spite of struggling with dependency issues and chronic unemployment. Hernandez began interrogating Darien Fluffhead about his presence in the neighborhood and his high-spirited behavior. When Fluffhead declined to participate in this unexpected interrogation, Hernandez raised the stakes for unknown reasons, demanding that Fluffhead submit immediately to stop-and-frisk event. While witnesses differ on what happened next, it's fairly clear that almost immediately after the officer somehow stumbled to the ground, a fusillade of shots rang out. When paramedics arrived, they found Darien Fluffhead shattered and broken in a puddle of blood with numerous lethal wounds from an entire clip of high-powered bullets from the officer's gun. Hernandez, who suffered only minor injuries, was seen joking and laughing with colleagues at the grisly scene. This latest killing of a black man by a white or Hispanic officer promises to further heighten tensions between the community and a police department known for highly questionable practices that have resulted in multiple individual lawsuits and remediation orders from the state's Civil Rights Commission."

I personally am strongly opposed to routine cop brutality and corrupt practices such as looting people of their property at will by the side of the road under the umbrella of so-called "civil forfeiture" laws, but I'm also seriously ticked off by the routine lying and smearing of honest cops by leftist vermin with extremely nasty agendas. Fair is fair.

Karl wrote:Shooting stories get embellished by media writers in order to sound flashier. Nothing is surprising about that.

[....]
Last edited by bumpylight on Tue 10 Jan 2017 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby Karl » Sun 08 Jan 2017 12:13 am

In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life. If someone is fleeing you are therefore no longer being threatened therefore you are not justified in shooting them from that point on, unless they are heading in the direction of your family or friends.

Best case if you shoot a fleeing person is that you will lose your CFP.

Worst case is a charge of murder-2 or manslaughter. Both of those carry prison time.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby althor » Tue 10 Jan 2017 8:14 am

Karl wrote:In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life...


In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby Karl » Tue 10 Jan 2017 9:44 am

althor wrote:
Karl wrote:In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life...


In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.

I wonder who is teaching those supposed classes?
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby althor » Tue 10 Jan 2017 9:52 am

Karl wrote:
althor wrote:
Karl wrote:In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life...


In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.

I wonder who is teaching those supposed classes?


Perhaps someone familiar with Utah Code 76-2-402(1)(a) and (b)
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby Karl » Tue 10 Jan 2017 10:13 am

"In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.[/quote]"

"I wonder who is teaching those supposed classes?[/quote]"

"Perhaps someone familiar with Utah Code 76-2-402(1)(a) and (b)[/quote]"



Hmm ... probably not ... see below:

76-2-402. Force in defense of person -- Forcible felony defined.

(1)
(a) A person is justified in threatening or using force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that force or a threat of force is necessary to defend the person or a third person against another person's imminent use of unlawful force.

(b) A person is justified in using force intended or likely to cause death or serious bodily injury only if the person reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to the person or a third person as a result of another person's imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

_____________________________________

There is no justification in the above statutory language for shooting a fleeing person.

I suggest you do not try it nor encourage anyone else to either.

If your CFP instructor taught you otherwise, then both of you will be standing tall in front of a judge if you do.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby bumpylight » Tue 10 Jan 2017 10:18 am

Geez, Karl, dude. Now you're just being argumentative. Even in liberal New York State, the law recognizes the act of levying deadly force against a violent attacker to protect the life and safety of another, even a stranger. The statute specifically names the criminal offenses of kidnapping, robbery, forcible rape or other forcible criminal sexual act and any commission of arson that threatens the life and safety of others. See NYS penal code section 35 through 35-20 for more details.

http://ypdcrime.com/penal.law/article35.htm#p35.00

In Texas, deadly force is justified to protect "mere" property under certain circumstances.

http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/ ... -9-42.html

The laws and precedents regarding the justification of deadly force vary considerably across the several States, and residents of any state are well advised to familiarize themselves with the specific statutes and precedents for their own jurisdictions.

Karl wrote:
althor wrote:
Karl wrote:In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life...


In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.

I wonder who is teaching those supposed classes?


Update: Ah, I see the thread raced by my reply during the lengthy time I took to compose it. :raisedbrow:
Last edited by bumpylight on Tue 10 Jan 2017 1:07 pm, edited 5 times in total.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby althor » Tue 10 Jan 2017 10:30 am

Karl wrote:Hmm ... probably not ... see below:

76-2-402. Force in defense of person -- Forcible felony defined.

(1)
(a) A person is justified in threatening or using force against another when and to the extent that the person reasonably believes that force or a threat of force is necessary to defend the person or a third person against another person's imminent use of unlawful force.

(b) A person is justified in using force intended or likely to cause death or serious bodily injury only if the person reasonably believes that force is necessary to prevent death or serious bodily injury to the person or a third person as a result of another person's imminent use of unlawful force, or to prevent the commission of a forcible felony.

_____________________________________

There is no justification in the above statutory language for shooting a fleeing person.

I suggest you do not try it nor encourage anyone else to either.

If your CFP instructor taught you otherwise, then both of you will be standing tall in front of a judge if you do.


Well, pasting the excerpt from the code illustrates my point. Here is what you said:

In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life.


The law allows one to use force in defense of one's own life, or to prevent grave bodily injury to one's self, or in defense of a third party for the same. I said nothing about a fleeing person. You appear to be making multiple claims, and I responded to only one of them... which I thought was clear.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby bumpylight » Tue 10 Jan 2017 10:49 am

Ah, but you forgot to address the law regarding using a non-scoped, .17-caliber sniper rifle from the basket of a hot-air balloon to shoot between three to four rounds but certainly not five or more rounds in rapid succession at a rabid jackal snapping at the flanks of a half-grown kangaroo that has just escaped from a federally subsidized wildlife preserve. What do you have to say about that, huh, huh? :ack:

Personally, I'm inclined to flee wildly from this increasingly silly exhibition of cross-purposed chat. :wink:

althor wrote:[....]

The law allows one to use force in defense of one's own life, or to prevent grave bodily injury to one's self, or in defense of a third party for the same. I said nothing about a fleeing person. You appear to be making multiple claims, and I responded to only one of them... which I thought was clear.
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Re: Quick-Thinking Cop in April 2016 Walmart Shooting

Postby Karl » Tue 10 Jan 2017 12:43 pm

althor wrote:
Karl wrote:In the various CFP classes taught all across the USA they always emphasize that you may only shoot in defense of your own life...


In the three classes that I've sat in on, that was not the case. Good thing too, since it is not correct.

Well this sounds like you think you can shoot someone who is fleeing.

It sounds like plain English to me.

Maybe you were thinking one thing and saying another.

Or maybe I read you wrong.
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