Butterfly knives

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Butterfly knives

Postby BlackGhost97 » Wed 20 Oct 2010 7:40 pm

ok well i am looking for a butterfly knife but first i should find out if they are legal. i would use it for work, self defence, and to pass the time learning tricks. Also if they are legal what are restrictions that i should know about?
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby one4freedom » Thu 21 Oct 2010 9:14 am

There's nothing wrong with owning a butterfly knife. If you want to carry it, you do need to have your concealed license as the license covers carrying deadly weapons and not just firearms.

I used to have one when like 12 yrs old. They're fun.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby Car Knocker » Thu 21 Oct 2010 10:16 am

14freedom wrote:There's nothing wrong with owning a butterfly knife. If you want to carry it, you do need to have your concealed license as the license covers carrying deadly weapons and not just firearms.

Not being very familiar with knife laws, I'm curious why one would need a CFP to carry a butterfly knife with a 5" blade when a CFP isn't needed to carry a regular folding knife with a 5" blade? Or is a CFP needed to legally carry either one in a pocket?
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby one4freedom » Thu 21 Oct 2010 10:46 am

I was taking my info from here: https://www.utahconcealedcarry.com/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=9479

I suppose I shouldn't have used the word "need" for having a CFP to carry a knife. It's more that there could be an argument made that a knife of any style is being carried as a weapon and having the CFP will render that question moot.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby RanzITman » Thu 21 Oct 2010 10:58 am

I did some research a while back about utah knife laws and could not find anything directly pertaining to what you can or cannot carry. That's at the state level. The downside to that is the laws against carrying a deadly weapon. Obviously a knife (any knife) could be considered a deadly weapon and depending on the situation that envolved you with law enforcment you could be charged.

I would like to say you are covered with a CFP but my research leads me to believe your are not. Utah has state preemption on carrying a firearm, which means if you conform to the state laws no county or city laws can interfere. I can find no such preemption with knives meaning the local laws may cause you some heartburn. One good example is in Logan. I carry an OTF knife with me where and whenever I can but I don't take with me when I go to Logan because they have specific laws about knives and completely ban any knife that open by pushing a button. As a CFP holder the state law covers me where it does not directly conflict with local laws but where it does, I think I'm on my own. Will they make trouble for you? I don't know. Can they? I believe so.. :disgusted:

I hope someone out there can show me I'm wrong on this because it somewhat irritates me but that is how I have interpreted what I found.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby kccraft » Thu 21 Oct 2010 12:22 pm

The link that 14freedom provided gives a good explanation of how knives fit into the Utah CFP and deadly weapon laws. In a nutshell, I take away that a typical folder would be easy to explain away as a utility tool, while a butterfly knife has more of an "evil black weapon" look to it and you might have more trouble with that.

As far as local knife laws... you might have a point there. Utah's Uniform Firearm laws are great that they keep things consistent when it comes to firearms, but even if you are generally allowed to carry a fighting knife or other dangerous weapon by virtue of a CFP, it seems possible that you could run afoul of local rules like you mentioned above.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby TacticalEdgeStore » Thu 21 Oct 2010 1:56 pm

The biggest problem you run into with carrying knives is the "concealed dangerous weapon" statute.

This is easily gotten around by having the knife clipped in your pocket, with the clip showing - thereby making it not-concealed.

If you have a knife in your pocket with no part of it showing, it could be considered a concealed dangerous weapon.

The Concealed Firearms Permit doesn't not "allow" you to carry a concealed dangerous weapon, but it does exempt you from penalties for doing so (as I read the statute).
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby kccraft » Thu 21 Oct 2010 2:21 pm

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:The Concealed Firearms Permit doesn't not "allow" you to carry a concealed dangerous weapon, but it does exempt you from penalties for doing so (as I read the statute).


Isn't this pretty much the same thing? If the illegality of it (the penalty) is removed, how are you not allowed to do it?
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby divegeek » Thu 21 Oct 2010 2:42 pm

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:This is easily gotten around by having the knife clipped in your pocket, with the clip showing - thereby making it not-concealed.

I've never seen a butterfly knife with a clip.

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:The Concealed Firearms Permit doesn't not "allow" you to carry a concealed dangerous weapon, but it does exempt you from penalties for doing so (as I read the statute).

It also doesn't "allow" you to carry a concealed firearm, but it does exempt you from the penalties for doing so. I think that's a distinction without a difference.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby TacticalEdgeStore » Sat 23 Oct 2010 11:07 am

divegeek wrote:It also doesn't "allow" you to carry a concealed firearm, but it does exempt you from the penalties for doing so. I think that's a distinction without a difference.


I disagree. By being a "permit", it is issuing you "permission" or therefore specifically "allowing" you to carry a firearm in a concealed manner.

I believe that exempting you from penalties allows you to carry a concealed weapon without the need for a specific permit to do so.
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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby divegeek » Sat 23 Oct 2010 12:25 pm

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:
divegeek wrote:It also doesn't "allow" you to carry a concealed firearm, but it does exempt you from the penalties for doing so. I think that's a distinction without a difference.

I disagree. By being a "permit", it is issuing you "permission" or therefore specifically "allowing" you to carry a firearm in a concealed manner.

Which is equally true for other dangerous weapons, including knives. When the law defines the meaning of the permit, it makes no special distinction for firearms.

You're trying to draw a semantic difference between "allow" and "exempt from penalties" and you're also trying to say that the "allow" part applies only to firearms while the "exempt from penalties" part applies to other dangerous weapons. That position is not supported by the law. If you think it is, please cite the portion of the code that draws this distinction.

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:I believe that exempting you from penalties allows you to carry a concealed weapon without the need for a specific permit to do so.

Um, you MUST have a permit to legally carry a concealed dangerous weapon in the state of Utah. The Utah CFP or a concealed weapon permit from any other state or county is sufficient, as is the status of being a peace officer, but you must have a permit.
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Butterfly knives

Postby CDR_Glock » Thu 04 Nov 2010 8:22 pm

divegeek wrote:
TacticalEdgeStore wrote:This is easily gotten around by having the knife clipped in your pocket, with the clip showing - thereby making it not-concealed.

I've never seen a butterfly knife with a clip.

TacticalEdgeStore wrote:The Concealed Firearms Permit doesn't not "allow" you to carry a concealed dangerous weapon, but it does exempt you from penalties for doing so (as I read the statute).

It also doesn't "allow" you to carry a concealed firearm, but it does exempt you from the penalties for doing so. I think that's a distinction without a difference.


4 Balisongs with a clip in my case on this panel: Benchmade 51 (2), Cold Steel Arc Angel and a BM 42MC Limite.
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Panel three has a few Balisongs with clips: Spyderco's, Bradley mayhem and BM 32.

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Balisong that has a clip: MD Caldwell
Baliglowsong.
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Some of my Balisongs (got rid of 3 pictured):

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Re: Butterfly knives

Postby Dillbrow » Wed 05 Oct 2011 2:01 am

hmmm i cant really provide any usefull info but if i remember correctly. in some places like NC your allowed to own knives such as auto,natos, and butterflys but are not legal to carry clip or not
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