Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby bagpiper » Thu 21 May 2015 1:53 pm

aaron wrote:Well, it could be anything. You have to remember that if you're open carrying and a crime has been reported in the vicinity you will raise some red flags. In my opinion open carry is a very poor choice unless you are in a rural area or out in the middle of nowhere. Now don't get me wrong. I'm one of the most avid supporters of exercising your rights, but in Utah, a shall issue state, there is not a real reason you need to go through all the hassle. Just carry concealed. :roll:


Well sure, because if a couple of 17 year old Polynesian punks knock off a convenience store, this fat, balding, pasty white, middle aged dude is going to raise red flags because of my gun. :disgusted:

If a crime has been reported in the vicinity and I match the description of the suspect, I'm going to raise red flags whether I'm visibly armed or not. And a middle-aged white guy, the crime most likely to be committed by anyone whose description I might match is probably something like pedophilia, rather than armed robbery.

Not to mention the fact that I'm really hard pressed to find many cases where armed criminals open carry their firearms in proper holsters.

I'm a fan of CC. I'm a fan of OC. I'm a huge fan of CCC which is either casually concealed carry or "I don't give a rip whether anyone sees my lawfully possessed firearm or not. I'm neither trying to hide it nor trying to expose it. I just don't care to modify my attire around a gun."

When OCing or CCCing, I am almost always CCing a BUG.

As for why OC, or "hassle": Even here along the Wasatch Front, we have several months a year when a cover garment is going to be too warm. St. George spends most of the year with temperatures in that range.

My Utah permit entitles to me carry concealed if I desire. It also allows me to legally carry openly, fully loaded, and into gun free school zones if that is what I want to do. I don't OC every day, but it isn't unusual for me to OC.

In almost 15+ years of doing so along the Wasatch Front, I've had 2 police encounters as a result. Neither was unpleasant or negative. I've also had the chance to have dozens of conversations and provide some education to folks about Utah gun laws.

OCing isn't for everyone I'd never suggest any gun owner has any obligation to do so. But neither should any of us presume to tell anyone else that he shouldn't OC. There are rare exceptions based on personal situations. But generally? No real reason not to OC in Utah if that is what someone wants to do.

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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby Uinta Firearms » Fri 22 May 2015 10:20 am

aaron wrote:Well, it could be anything. You have to remember that if you're open carrying and a crime has been reported in the vicinity you will raise some red flags. In my opinion open carry is a very poor choice unless you are in a rural area or out in the middle of nowhere. Now don't get me wrong. I'm one of the most avid supporters of exercising your rights, but in Utah, a shall issue state, there is not a real reason you need to go through all the hassle. Just carry concealed. :roll:

If not in Utah, then where?

When responding, be mindful that I have lived all over the US. I'm currently in Chicagoland, and will be moving to Philadelphia at the end of July.
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby SirGentleman » Fri 22 May 2015 10:22 am

Uinta Firearms wrote:
aaron wrote:Well, it could be anything. You have to remember that if you're open carrying and a crime has been reported in the vicinity you will raise some red flags. In my opinion open carry is a very poor choice unless you are in a rural area or out in the middle of nowhere. Now don't get me wrong. I'm one of the most avid supporters of exercising your rights, but in Utah, a shall issue state, there is not a real reason you need to go through all the hassle. Just carry concealed. :roll:

If not in Utah, then where?

When responding, be mindful that I have lived all over the US. I'm currently in Chicagoland, and will be moving to Philadelphia at the end of July.


You should move back to Utah. Just sayin'. :P
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby Uinta Firearms » Fri 22 May 2015 10:40 am

SirGentleman wrote:
Uinta Firearms wrote:
aaron wrote:Well, it could be anything. You have to remember that if you're open carrying and a crime has been reported in the vicinity you will raise some red flags. In my opinion open carry is a very poor choice unless you are in a rural area or out in the middle of nowhere. Now don't get me wrong. I'm one of the most avid supporters of exercising your rights, but in Utah, a shall issue state, there is not a real reason you need to go through all the hassle. Just carry concealed. :roll:

If not in Utah, then where?

When responding, be mindful that I have lived all over the US. I'm currently in Chicagoland, and will be moving to Philadelphia at the end of July.


You should move back to Utah. Just sayin'. :P

You're preaching to the choir. The state already gets my taxes. My corporate HQ is located in Salt Lake County. But, the wife and I are busy doing our duty to keep America free. Retirement (for her) is at least 14 years away. Once retirement is achieved it will be my turn. I want to try to setup shop in a district where the elected official is anti 2A, and try to introduce them to the back of the unemployment line. Holladay is looking like a nice target right now.

Anyways, we're getting off topic and I don't want to disrespect the OP.
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby aaron » Thu 28 May 2015 5:30 pm

Hahaha alright guys. Well, I made it a point to say that I was giving my opinion on OC'ing. I totally agree that the decision is personal and you should do whatever you darn well please. I respect people who open carry. I'm just saying that when you OC you draw attention that I, personally, don't care for. There are other reasons I don't do it, like that fact that it would be easier for someone to take your gun, and you automatically become the first target if someone walks in to rob/shoot up a place. Now, I will agree that its a lot more comfortable and your gun is more accessible, but for me, personally, the pro's don't outweigh the cons. :mrgreen:
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby J_dazzle23 » Thu 28 May 2015 5:41 pm

aaron wrote:Hahaha alright guys. Well, I made it a point to say that I was giving my opinion on OC'ing. I totally agree that the decision is personal and you should do whatever you darn well please. I respect people who open carry. I'm just saying that when you OC you draw attention that I, personally, don't care for. There are other reasons I don't do it, like that fact that it would be easier for someone to take your gun, and you automatically become the first target if someone walks in to rob/shoot up a place. Now, I will agree that its a lot more comfortable and your gun is more accessible, but for me, personally, the pro's don't outweigh the cons. :mrgreen:

Opinions aside....

I think there is a LARGE unofficial pot of money over at opencarry.org for the first person to have their gun taken or been attacked BECAUSE they were open carrying (targeted).....

I believe that money has been waiting to be paid out for a VERY long time.

Not to derail the thread- but do some research on people snatching guns for open carriers....you will find a very short list ;)
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby Sam Fidler » Fri 29 May 2015 9:47 am

aaron wrote:There are other reasons I don't do it, like that fact that it would be easier for someone to take your gun, and you automatically become the first target if someone walks in to rob/shoot up a place.


If your definition of "automatically" is "never" then I would agree. Otherwise, why are people so afraid of something that has never happened?
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby aaron » Fri 29 May 2015 2:05 pm

Sam Fidler wrote:
aaron wrote:There are other reasons I don't do it, like that fact that it would be easier for someone to take your gun, and you automatically become the first target if someone walks in to rob/shoot up a place.


If your definition of "automatically" is "never" then I would agree. Otherwise, why are people so afraid of something that has never happened?


Here a couple times that stuff "did" happened. :)

Attacked for gun.
Teen takes gun from open carrier in gas staition robbery and kills two people
Shot by police for just open carrying.
Open carrier robbed for his gun
Open carrier robbed at gunpoint.

Just some food for thought. I don't have time to keep reading through the other similar articles. :thumbsup:
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby JoeSparky » Fri 29 May 2015 8:54 pm

aaron wrote:
Sam Fidler wrote:
aaron wrote:There are other reasons I don't do it, like that fact that it would be easier for someone to take your gun, and you automatically become the first target if someone walks in to rob/shoot up a place.


If your definition of "automatically" is "never" then I would agree. Otherwise, why are people so afraid of something that has never happened?


Here a couple times that stuff "did" happened. :)

Attacked for gun.
Teen takes gun from open carrier in gas staition robbery and kills two people
Shot by police for just open carrying.
Open carrier robbed for his gun
Open carrier robbed at gunpoint.Just some food for thought. I don't have time to keep reading through the other similar articles.
:thumbsup:

Suggesting you do some research into these incidents you've listed---- MANY if not all have probably been discussed at length on this or other Open Carry type sites.
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby aaron » Fri 29 May 2015 9:21 pm

JoeSparky wrote:Suggesting you do some research into these incidents you've listed---- MANY if not all have probably been discussed at length on this or other Open Carry type sites.


Thanks for letting me know, but the only reason I posted them was because I wanted to inform Sam that, although "automatically" is the wrong word, "never" isn't the word I was looking for. Just maybe "there's a good chance".
:beathorse:
I'll look into those discussions out though, sounds like they could be interesting.
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby JoeSparky » Fri 29 May 2015 9:38 pm

aaron wrote:
JoeSparky wrote:Suggesting you do some research into these incidents you've listed---- MANY if not all have probably been discussed at length on this or other Open Carry type sites.


Thanks for letting me know, but the only reason I posted them was because I wanted to inform Sam that, although "automatically" is the wrong word, "never" isn't the word I was looking for. Just maybe "there's a good chance".
:beathorse:
I'll look into those discussions out though, sounds like they could be interesting.

I do know that in the first case you listed the headline was not supported in the associated article. Most likely the man wielding the bat was mentally disturbed and had no idea the man he attacked even had a gun. There is some speculation included in the article from those not present when the attack happened as to a "possible" motive, but nothing reported to support those assertions! :thumbsup:
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Re: Witnessed an interesting police encounter last night

Postby J_dazzle23 » Sat 30 May 2015 1:08 am

So tens if not hundreds of thousands of people open carry and we can count on one hand the "maybe's"....
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